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Operating System Specific Discussions => Other Operating Systems => Topic started by: AmigaClassicRule on January 24, 2013, 07:11:04 AM
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I mean I love Windows 7. Windows 7 is an awesome operating system and I hate Windows 8 with the greatest of passion, but Windows XP is a great Windows OS too and wondering if it is really dead now?
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I haven't used XP in a couple of years so no idea. At the time it seemed to actually run the stuff I needed to run.
However, recently I tried to install Visual Studio Express 2012 on a machine that's only about 3 or 4 years old that came with Windows Vista and that was a no go - needs Windows 7 or newer. Heck it didn't even bother checking for Windows 7 during the install, it just fails with an obscure error when you run it. Anyway I found that a bit shocking. I guess even Vista is almost 6 years old, but still I thought that was a bit quick of MS to be pulling the plug on supporting it with their own products.
I snidely figured this was how Microsoft was going to make money off their "free" products, forcing us to buy their latest OS all the time now. It would also make their "latest OS" adoption rates improve so things like Windows 8 won't be deemed a failure if you NEED it to run stuff. I think they are a bit worried that people are just happy to use whatever Windows OS came on their computer until the computer is dead and buried - I'm certainly in that category, I'll never do a Windows upgrade.
Anyway, if Vista is already considered this dead to them then XP is going to be even deader. But at long as it runs whatever you want to run I guess it's fine, though you might want to keep it off the internet if MS has stopped releasing security patches.
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Dead? Well, that's really a point of view.
According to Microsoft, end of support is April 8, 2014 (XP SP3 and Office 2003) where end of support means no new security updates, non-security hotfixes, free or paid assisted support options or online technical content updates (read more at http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/endofsupport.aspx).
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Lots of businesses still use xp. The hospital I work for still has windows xp desktops but they are phasing in Windows 7 machines now to replace broken machines. Windows xp has been a solid platform for Microsoft and is still solid now.
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Microsoft (http://windows.microsoft.com/en-US/windows/end-support-help) says: "Support for Windows XP is ending on April 8, 2014. If you're running this version after support ends, you won't get security updates for Windows."
Not too long until that :/ I've been thinking what to do with family members with XP:s still in use and working perfectly fine for them. Almost grabbed cheap Win 8 upgrade offer which is available for this month still, but seems it doesn't work with P4/2.8GHz CPUs we have around. Missing the NX bit... soo.. I guess we'll let them be XP still and see what happens :)
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I still use XP on a daily basis, I prefer it over other windows distros
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we use xp at work for the computers that control hardware, and Win 7 for other use
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XP was a very solid OS but win7 and win8 are a lot better, IMO. especially with classic shell installed, windows 8 is very nice. It removes the new interface and brings back the old start menu. Just my opinion.
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I think until the security patches stop been released for xp there is no need for people to immediately upgrade but maybe at the very least start thinking about saving money for new hardware. While I like Windows 7, And grudgingly use 8 on my wifes laptop, I don't think there is any need for panic just yet if people are comfortable and still have software that works.
Most businesses that still run XP, and a lot of public services do, will probably be already looking to start upgrading the Windows 7. There is already some systems that are Windows 7 at the hospital I work at in key areas just to make sure comparability and stability is there. After all we don't want an X-Ray machine doing a BSOD on us midway through a scan lol.
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My company only upgraded my work computer to Windows 7 three months ago. My personal machine still runs XP. Most software still supports XP. The end is nigh, but it's not here yet.
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My company only upgraded my work computer to Windows 7 three months ago. My personal machine still runs XP. Most software still supports XP. The end is nigh, but it's not here yet.
Exactly. :)
I have a relative that was still using my old Win 98se Dell, that I gave her 8 years ago, up to the begining of last year. She never went on the net and only did word processing and played a few games. I would imagine there is an army of people that are like this with XP.
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I run Linux on all my machines, but have XP loaded under VirtualBox on all of them. I use it for WinUAE, and other things. XP is my favorite Windows version. I will keep using it until I can't, then I will use Windows 7. I like Windows 7 pretty good as well, but not as much as XP. As far as Windows 8, won't use it. I tried it for awhile under VirtualBox, when they had the free trial, and hated it. I think XP use will be around for a long time. They may not support it, but will still have all the updates available under Windows Update, to the point where support stopped. That just means there will be no new patches put out. I downloaded all three service packs, and IE 8, so I can upgrade it mostly without even going to Windows Update. I don't use it as a main OS, so, I am not worried about viruses and such from web browsing. I download everything on the Linux side. I do have Avast loaded on the XP, though, to scan downloaded files. XP is a great OS, and I think it's use will continue for some time. Just my opinion, though.
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On older machines there is really no reason to move off it. But both home and corporate users will find that any new PC or MB/CPU/Memory upgrade will most likely not have support driver support for xp.
It's definitely on the cart..
Windows 8 is a different OS experience to Windows 7/Vista. On a touch device it's totally different than mouse based. If you are prepared to re-learn how to do certain things it's quite powerful. But a lot of people expect it to work the same as the previous OS, I did. Once I understood what they were trying to achieve I understood the benefits. Still I wish you could see your apps running in some kind of task bar at the bottom of the screen. Flicking through pages is fine if you have touch but a pain with a mouse. SP1 please...sorry ranting off topic..
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Exactly. :)
I have a relative that was still using my old Win 98se Dell, that I gave her 8 years ago, up to the begining of last year. She never went on the net and only did word processing and played a few games. I would imagine there is an army of people that are like this with XP.
I still use Windows XP and it does absolutely everything I need it to do (video editing, music, desktop publishing, 2D and 3D graphics, emulation, word processing, internet) - and I would say that I am a more intensive computer user than your average homeowner who just uses his/her computer for e-mail/internet and the occassional game.
I also have a couple of highly useful applications (i.e. Windows 98 era) which will still run on Windows XP but apparently won't run on later version of Windows.
I hope to be able to continue using XP even past 2014 if possible - I certainly still continue to use AmigaOS and I did use Windows 98 long past its support date (until about 2007).
In fact, I've been thinking about what will happen when / if I actually need to upgrade my hardware. I'd like to find a more modern system that will STILL run Windows XP - mainly for the sole attraction of the additional CPU cores that will make my existing video editing software etc. even faster.
I wonder if you could even take a machine manufactured in 2012/2013, wipe the more modern OS and install Windows XP on it.
I have heard about the virtual machine support in the new versions of Windows. This seems good.
I'm not really concerned about lack of software support once XP is no longer supported my MicroSoft - heck, if I did I wouldn't be using Amiga stuff as well. I'm sure there will be a huge body of independent users and programmers still supporting Windows XP (you can still find good support and modern applications / hacks for Windows 98 if you look).
I've always been a fan of older software. For example, I think a hard working, creative person can do more with an older version of Photoshop (or, heck, even DPaint) then a less motivated person can do with the latest cutting edge version.
So - is the ONLY really compelling reason to upgrade to a later version of Windows (if you're happy with older software) the lack of security patches?
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So - is the ONLY really compelling reason to upgrade to a later version of Windows (if you're happy with older software) the lack of security patches?
Nup, Lack of driver support for new hardware is the biggy. And growing...
I like your usage profile, simular to mine. I have still have Windows 98 apps (32 bit) that run fine on Win8. Studio 5 is one example. In fact I haven't had an XP app/game I've purchased, that I can think of, not run on Vista-Win7-Win8.
PS: It's more modern apps that want you to upgrade and try to block you from installing older versions of their app on new OS's. Nero is one example. But they are usually easy to get around.
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So - is the ONLY really compelling reason to upgrade to a later version of Windows (if you're happy with older software) the lack of security patches?
IMHO, in the most cases, yes. And when it's Windows we're talking, it feels quite forcing reason :(
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Actually, XP is pretty dead.
If you have a CD that pre-date SP3, you've got to manually install SP3.
It doesn't always work correctly.
And in a little over a year, updates for SP3 stop.
A good run, but it about done.
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No.
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I mean I love Windows 7. Windows 7 is an awesome operating system and I hate Windows 8 with the greatest of passion, but Windows XP is a great Windows OS too and wondering if it is really dead now?
Windows 8 is great and I don't miss the start menu at all now, I tried various methods of resurrecting it during the beta days but after installing the release candidates and then RTM I just stopped bothering with it. Anything new takes a while to get used to, I remember people complaining about the start menu in 1995.
XP might not be dead, but I haven't used it in 6 years. The number of users is decreasing, but at what point do you class an operating system as dead? Office 2013 is not supported on XP, I'm sure a lot of companies who still release software for it will stop soon as well.
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I do not get it. What happens if it indeed security patches are no longer supported? Does this make Windows XP unusable if you login to the internet and it is 100% guaranteed you will be under attack right away that forces you to upgrade OS?
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I too like Windows XP but it is growing old with security issues that Windows 7 (for example) does not have. When support for Windows XP end on 04/14, just watch the attacks fly! The slime that write the virii and malware know how popular Windows XP is so they are going to prey on people who do not upgrade. They know without MS supporting XP, it will be an easy target.
I read that Windows XP with just SP1 attached to the Internet can be remotely owned by someone in around 20 mins.
It was a great version of Windows that is sadly showing its age...
-P
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I too like Windows XP but it is growing old with security issues that Windows 7 (for example) does not have. When support for Windows XP end on 04/14, just watch the attacks fly! The slime that write the virii and malware know how popular Windows XP is so they are going to prey on people who do not upgrade. They know without MS supporting XP, it will be an easy target.
I read that Windows XP with just SP1 attached to the Internet can be remotely owned by someone in around 20 mins.
It was a great version of Windows that is sadly showing its age...
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That's so sad and I really hope it's not as bad as you say.
I really want to continue using XP for as long as possible.
I guess that's one advantage of a fring OS like AmigaOS. It's so on the fringes no one bothers to write malware for it.
I wonder if anyone's still bothering to write malware / attack Win98 computers.
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I too like Windows XP but it is growing old with security issues that Windows 7 (for example) does not have. When support for Windows XP end on 04/14, just watch the attacks fly! The slime that write the virii and malware know how popular Windows XP is so they are going to prey on people who do not upgrade. They know without MS supporting XP, it will be an easy target.
I read that Windows XP with just SP1 attached to the Internet can be remotely owned by someone in around 20 mins.
It was a great version of Windows that is sadly showing its age...
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Why I have this conspiracy feeling that Microsoft itself is hiring these people to attack people who still use Windows XP to force them to buy and upgrade to a newer version of Windows?
I do not know, it does not seem far fetched if you think about it.
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I use nLite to strip Windows XP so ir requires minimal HDD space and a low amount of ram.
I have a Thin Client with a low power mobile AMD 1GHz CPU (not fast) and 128MB ram and 1GB ATA flash storage.
Shrinked Windows XP keeping functionality down to 200MB HDD install and 50MB ram usage and it flied quick on the Thin Client.
Later I added put 1GB ram in the machine and 10x 2TB hdds with USB adapters and now I am using the thin client as a Torrent seedbox, works perfectly and does not consume much power, perfect as a seedbox :)
If anyone want a quick Windows XP but do not want to use nLite check out "TinyXP", runs great and requires very little.
So for me WIndows XP works great for a lot of things, good compability for new software and a small footprint is a great combo for slower machines :)
You can shrink Windows 7 a lot also but it's more heavy overall and not needed on slower machines, Windows 7 did run like crap on a 766MHz Transmeta Crusoe CPU with 128MB ram and Rage XL graphics chip but WXP ran nice, W98 was to limited and Linux had drivers issues.
Well yeah I like buying Thin Clients and use them as standalone PC's ;)
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I mean I love Windows 7. Windows 7 is an awesome operating system and I hate Windows 8 with the greatest of passion, but Windows XP is a great Windows OS too and wondering if it is really dead now?
I didnt think in my lifetime i would hear anyone state that they "love" (any version) windows with such passion! Ill reserve my own opinions on what comes out of Redmond for fear of starting a flame war - but I just thought most people used Windows did so because it was de-facto - not because it was particularly good. All this coming from an Amiga fan ... sheesh - what is the world coming to !
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I didnt think in my lifetime i would hear anyone state that they "love" (any version) windows with such passion! Ill reserve my own opinions on what comes out of Redmond for fear of starting a flame war - but I just thought most people used Windows did so because it was de-facto - not because it was particularly good. All this coming from an Amiga fan ... sheesh - what is the world coming to !
No offense polyp2000, but Windows XP deserves a little loving and so does Windows 7. They are after all great OSes. In the world of PC and the huge market for software and games, we need good OS (unless going to an alternate OS which limits you in apps and games) and so far Windows XP and 7 have won the prize in the world of Windows and PC. Thus the least I could do is just love it.
I have had very little troubles with Windows XP either from crashing to whatever you name it. Doesn't that give me justifying to love it for this at least? Through Windows XP I am managing to import movies to run on A1200, doesn't it at least deserve this credit of love?
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The only thing about old versions of Windows is that Microsoft makes you activate them online.
This sucks if you are just installing it on a computer without an internet connection, or if there comes a day when Microsoft just won't support the old version AT ALL.
That's why I like 98 - you don't need to go online to activate it.
I wish there was some way to disable this online activation in XP for owners of legit copies who want to continue to use it long after support and registration servers are dropped.
I know there are probably cracked .iso images online but who wants to install a cracked version of Windows XP that is probably full of hidden malware? I prefer to use a clean, OEM installation disc.
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The only thing about old versions of Windows is that Microsoft makes you activate them online.
This sucks if you are just installing it on a computer without an internet connection, or if there comes a day when Microsoft just won't support the old version AT ALL.
That's why I like 98 - you don't need to go online to activate it.
I wish there was some way to disable this online activation in XP for owners of legit copies who want to continue to use it long after support and registration servers are dropped.
I know there are probably cracked .iso images online but who wants to install a cracked version of Windows XP that is probably full of hidden malware? I prefer to use a clean, OEM installation disc.
Well nothing stops you from creating your own pre-activated Windows ISO, it's easier then you think, also who gets cracked Windows ISO's from open trackers? There are non malware containing scene releases if you know where to look.
Edit: Also if memory serves me right pre SP ISO's of Windows XP pro requires no activation and you can install offline SP's later if you need them.
I am quite sure I got a few legit Windows XP CD's that do NOT require anything more then the CD-key under installation.
Also Windows FLP requires no activation and is less demanding then the normal Windows XP.
Edit: Hmm thinking of it I do not think I own any version of Windows XP professional that requires online activation at all, just skip the end steps with checking for connection and Windows Update and set them yourself and no version I have used had required me to activate online.
Tell me if you need a clean Windows XP professional ISO without activation requirement and ill make an ISO from my oldest Windows XP CD's without SP.
Edit: I am downloading the "Windows XP Service Pack 3 - ISO-9660 CD Image File" from Microsoft's Download center to check if it needs activation when installed.
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I mean I love Windows 7. Windows 7 is an awesome operating system and I hate Windows 8 with the greatest of passion, but Windows XP is a great Windows OS too and wondering if it is really dead now?
There is no point to stay on Windows 7, if you have the chance to get Windows 8 for few bucks. Its faster in loading (mostly visible on older computers), smaller memory footprint, network performance is improved. People hate Metro, me too, but there are few applications that give you back start menu, if you prefer, and some of them are free and some even have more options then original Windows 7 start menu had.
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I detested windows 8 however it's slowly growing on me. And I spend more time on the "classic" desktop so I don't deal with metro very much. Thats not to say I outright like it now. I am still not impressed with metro and certain things, like having to go to hot coners to alter settings, still annoy me.
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I mean I love Windows 7. Windows 7 is an awesome operating system and I hate Windows 8 with the greatest of passion, but Windows XP is a great Windows OS too and wondering if it is really dead now?
Discussions about the death of Windows XP are quite silly on an Amiga related website, IMHO. We should perfectly know nothing dies unless everybody stops using it forever and that won't be the case for Windows XP as well, for many many years.
From a commercial POV, XP has been already dead since the first netbooks with Windows 7 (replacing XP) came out 18-24 months ago.
From a technical POV, it is already dead since it does not support all the features new programs expect in Windows.
From a security POV it will be dead on April 8th, 2014, when Microsoft will release its latest security bulletin still supporting Windows XP and Windows Server 2003 (even if I am not pretty sure both systems will die together, maybe Win 2003 EOL can be anticipated).
But from the users POV it will die only when it won't be useful for anything more. Even into virtual machines. It will take AGES, before people will completely replace their favourite XP applications. Bare reality, however, is that new computers can't use XP directly, nor XP can use latest hardware features, so nobody will buy a new PC to install XP onto it.
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I detested windows 8 however it's slowly growing on me. And I spend more time on the "classic" desktop so I don't deal with metro very much. Thats not to say I outright like it now. I am still not impressed with metro and certain things, like having to go to hot coners to alter settings, still annoy me.
You know you can make your own hotkeys to open what you want without hassle? Could aid your W8 usage :)
For example, you might want a hotkey combination to open the classic control panel?
Well it's easy, right click on the control panel shortcut, select properties, in the "Shortcut" tab you have a field named "Shortcut key:" press either CTRL+Shift or CTRL+ALT and desired key, for example CTRL+ALT+C and press "OK".
Bam when you press CTRL+ALT+C the control panel opens.
You can do this to everything, web URL's, Administrator tools etc etc, nice and easy way to go to whatever you want no matter what Windows version you use, ive been doing this for ages for things like network settings, computer management etc :D
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I mean I love Windows 7. Windows 7 is an awesome operating system and I hate Windows 8 with the greatest of passion, but Windows XP is a great Windows OS too and wondering if it is really dead now?
If you buy a new computer, you won't have a choice. Dell is forcing Windows 8 on everyone.
Go to your local software store and see what the oldest Windows software you can buy is. Can you get new software for Windows 95? The answer will probably be "no". Pretty soon the stores will stop selling software for Windows XP and your answer will be "Windows XP is broken".
The other issue is length of life on hard drives. They have surface mount components and they don't all last beyond 5 years.
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I mean I love Windows 7. Windows 7 is an awesome operating system and I hate Windows 8 with the greatest of passion, but Windows XP is a great Windows OS too and wondering if it is really dead now?
It isn't dead so long as you keep it behind a meaty firewall and so forth. Same goes for Win2000, for that matter. Keep them protected and they'll continue to serve. My retro-game box runs Win98 and never, ever connects to the internet for any reason whatsoever. I've got the "Windows 98 Storage Driver" for USB and I sneakernet any files I need to it.
WinXP and 2k (well, maybe 2k) aren't that dire yet, so, enjoy.
You just won't get any patches for any particularly egregious bugs or problems with the core OS itself.
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XP was a very solid OS but win7 and win8 are a lot better, IMO. especially with classic shell installed, windows 8 is very nice. It removes the new interface and brings back the old start menu. Just my opinion.
I just wish there was a way to reenable Aero Glass :(
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I just wish there was a way to reenable Aero :(
Personally, I love Windows 7 as much as I love Windows XP and I will migrate to Windows 7. I want to see if I can skip Windows 8. Hopefully Windows 9 will be better. I treat Windows 8 as I would Vista and Windows ME.
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If you buy a new computer, you won't have a choice. Dell is forcing Windows 8 on everyone.
Go to your local software store and see what the oldest Windows software you can buy is. Can you get new software for Windows 95? The answer will probably be "no". Pretty soon the stores will stop selling software for Windows XP and your answer will be "Windows XP is broken".
The other issue is length of life on hard drives. They have surface mount components and they don't all last beyond 5 years.
What forces you to use W8 on DELL computers? I suspect you are talking about laptops since most enthusiast computer users put together their own desktops, but sure OEM laptops will move to newer OS but you can still format the drive and install whatever OS you want as long as there is drivers available (currently not much of an issue) also who buys OEM desktops?
Also due to the limits of the 32-bit kernel in Windows XP you have no real reason to buy a brand new laptop to use Windows XP on as long as there is working second hand ones.
What is the issue with hard drives? Are you talking about hard drives or solid state drives?
Since I got tons of more then 5 years old hard drives running 24/7 in my file server without issues, the biggest killer of hard drives is heat which is a problem for laptop users.
Running old software on newer OS is no issue, I use VMware to run DOS and Windows 3.11/95/98/2000/XP etc and run all legacy software I want without trouble, you can use whatever virtual box you want for that but VMware is Superior on many aspects and have DX9 support.
Besides software using later DirectX version (mostly games) than you can use on Windows XP much software will still run under Windows XP for quite some time, the gap between Windows 9x and NT based are mostly caused by the move to the NT based kernel of Windows XP so such dramatical compability issues will not be as apparent between XP and 8 before the leap to 64-bit software kicks in.
So I still do not see the issue, if you want to run unsupported legacy software you can, most things will run for quite some time on Windows XP still.
The biggest problem I can see is when new hardware do not get drivers for Windows XP but it wont be an issue since the Windows XP kernel is getting more and more outdated for new hardware anyways so XP wont be optimal anyways and if you want to keep using it you could run it trough virtual box or keep XP supported hardware.
Since there are already limited by the 32-bit version of Windows XP from both new CPU pov and the limited RAM capabilities including VRAM (not counting the broken 64-bit version of XP with very limited driver support) you will be forced to move to a new OS by time but only if you are in need of hardware not supported by XP.
So yes, Windows XP will die out due to new hardware and higher software requirements by time, but nothing stops you from running it on a VM or keeping XP supported hardware for a XP computer.
So bottom line, XP is a decent OS yes but getting to old, nothing stops you from using it for quite some time, if you are not limited by the 32-bit kernel keep using as long as you want.
But it will be outdated as time progress but I predict most software will keep running for quite some time on it.
Getting outdated, yes.
Dead, no since it depends on the user.
WOW, i wrote a lot of text here, hope it's understandable and not to much off-topic :)
Edit: Also as it looks now with possible release of Windows Blue this summer with cheaper more frequent upgrade releases it seems Windows won't get better and I hope to god Linux will rule the desktop market in 5-10 years time due to Microsofts new approach!
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I love windows 8 never felt windows 7 was anything other than a new vista.
However i used windows xp last summer on my old work laptop "car diagnostics" and mapping Standalone ECUs.
I kind of wished that XP was dead because 4 days with that crap and the unstability told me that windows have only improved over the years.
Anyways before i upgraded to windows 8 on that laptop i reinstalled a fresh version of XP and i am sure that win8 is faster on that computer. (panasonic TB CF-74).
Never looked back and never will..
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I love windows 8 never felt windows 7 was anything other than a new vista.
However i used windows xp last summer on my old work laptop "car diagnostics" and mapping Standalone ECUs.
I kind of wished that XP was dead because 4 days with that crap and the unstability told me that windows have only improved over the years.
Anyways before i upgraded to windows 8 on that laptop i reinstalled a fresh version of XP and i am sure that win8 is faster on that computer. (panasonic TB CF-74).
Never looked back and never will..
On somewhat new hardware XP is outdated yes, but if you are using older more performance limited hardware XP is more fitting then 7/8 (also much old hardware do not get drivers for new OS versions anymore).
So there still is some need for XP. As I wrote a few posts back I would never run W7/8 on my torrent seedbox since the hardware is to weak.
For the big mainstream masses that only have new hardware the need for XP is gone.
I ordered a new SoC Asus C8HM70-I/HDMI with a dual core 1,1GHz Intel Celeron 847 today for my car, it will be fun to see how a 17w TDP computer handles the newer OS:es.
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I think this is a pretty stupid topic to post on an Amiga forum!
To sum up, I use Linux OS most of the time. I first used it in 1999, when I was pressured into getting a PC because I couldn't afford all the Amiga upgrades I'd need to get onto the Internet. Back in 1999, I tried a few different Linux distros, but I couldn't connect to the Internet with them, because I had a modem which had something missing which a Windows driver made up for. This is called a "Winmodem". Later on, I got an external modem and was able to get online using Linux. Later still, I got a new laptop with Windows XP Media Center Edition, which encouraged me to fill up the hard drive with various stuff, then I soon realised I didn't have enough space to install Linux, so I forgot about it. Later still, I was living in temporary accommodation and watching a DVD on that laptop which I'd recorded off air in as low quality as possible to fit 6 hours onto the DVD. While in the middle of viewing it, Windows XP Media Center Edition decided it didn't like it, then crashed. It failed to reboot, because a very important file called something like System32.dll was missing or corrupted! I then faced a choice of using the manufacturer's System Restore DVD, which I soon realised would wiped out various data which I hadn't got round to backing up. The solution was to use a CD or DVD with a live version of Puppy Linux, because it's a small distro which loads into RAM, leaving the DVD-R/W drive free to copy my data onto. At that time, I needed to get online using a 3G dongle, so I eventually found I was able to do this using Ubuntu Linux, but not PC Linux OS. This is why I use Ubuntu Linux. Of course, Ubuntu Linux now seems to be dominating the World of Linux and could even wipe out all other Linux distros, so that may be a good reason not to use it any more. I think that Aeros OS, combining Aros OS with Linux sounds interesting http://www.aeros-os.org/ .
As for Windows XP, there are various interesting games such as The Sims, The Sims 2, and The Sims 3, which can only be run under Windows, so this is the only good reason to use Windows at all. Check the system requirements to see if they require a Windows Version later than XP. I think that anything else can be done either on Aeros OS, or Linux. Someone is trying to develop an open source alternative to MS Windows, which they call ReactOS http://www.reactos.org/en/index.html .
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As for Windows XP, there are various interesting games such as The Sims, The Sims 2, and The Sims 3, which can only be run under Windows, so this is the only good reason to use Windows at all. Check the system requirements to see if they require a Windows Version later than XP. I think that anything else can be done either on Aeros OS, or Linux. Someone is trying to develop an open source alternative to MS Windows, which they call ReactOS http://www.reactos.org/en/index.html .
There is loads of new games not possible to run under Linux, later DirectX based games do unfortunately not play nice with linux at all. OpenGL has a bright future tho and Steams move to Linux will speed things up so if we are lucky it will be a better future for gaming and Linux.
Also my wife plays the sims 3 on Linux, she has Linux mint installed and I got the sims 3 running for her under both the new Whine and PlayOnLinux but ofc there is performance loss. So I do not know why you think the sims do not run under Linux.
There are tho other reasons why I can't mainly only use Linux beside games, I have dual boot of both windows and Linux but as I have two AMD Radeon HD 7970 graphics cards and Linux works like crap on my main workstation due to those cards drivers are a mess under Linux right now.
Drivers are a big issue when using high end stuff under Linux and is one of the biggest obstacles for many people.
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In fact, I've been thinking about what will happen when / if I actually need to upgrade my hardware. I'd like to find a more modern system that will STILL run Windows XP - mainly for the sole attraction of the additional CPU cores that will make my existing video editing software etc. even faster.
You have to check into the hardware and make sure there are drivers available, but I've been pleasantly surprised by how much newer hardware still does support XP. Enough that I can probably keep going for the foreseeable future on refurbished laptops, anyway.
I'm still running XP on both my daily-driver laptop and my gaming PC - never touched Vista, and 7 has too much needless screwing around with UI stuff, only some of which can be fixed with third-party patches. XP runs all my software and lets me use the interface I'm familiar with from over fifteen years of running Win95 derivatives instead of forcing me into the New Way of doing things; why would I upgrade?
(I'm curious, though, I've heard that you can take the explorer.exe from XP and run it on 32-bit 7 - if that works, I might give it a shot. But at the moment I don't have a free machine to experiment with...)
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I'm still running XP on both my daily-driver laptop and my gaming PC - never touched Vista, and 7 has too much needless screwing around with UI stuff, only some of which can be fixed with third-party patches. XP runs all my software and lets me use the interface I'm familiar with from over fifteen years of running Win95 derivatives instead of forcing me into the New Way of doing things; why would I upgrade?
What games do you play on your gaming pc?
What specs are your gaming pc?
Are you using 32 or 64 bits windows xp?
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@thread
just an FYI: i've moved this thread to the 'other operating systems' forum since it wasn't specifically amiga related. shouldn't affect anything, though, in the thread itself. thanks!
-- eliyahu
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What games do you play on your gaming pc?
What specs are your gaming pc?
Are you using 32 or 64 bits windows xp?
32-bit XP, on a P4-2.8GHz (Prescott something-or-other) with 4GB DDR400 (just under 3GB recognized, but with all four it means I get dual-channel memory access) and a GeForce 7600 GT (8x AGP.) Aside from an attempt at Skyrim (the CPU and GPU aren't really up to it,) the newest thing I play on it is Oblivion. (I'm working on a heavily modded-up Morrowind install, though, I'm curious to see whether that will end up being more of a workout for the system...)
I'm looking at boosting it to a Core 2 board in the near future; I've already got a PCIe GeForce 8400 something-or-other to go with it.
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32-bit XP, on a P4-2.8GHz (Prescott something-or-other) with 4GB DDR400 (just under 3GB recognized, but with all four it means I get dual-channel memory access) and a GeForce 7600 GT (8x AGP.) Aside from an attempt at Skyrim (the CPU and GPU aren't really up to it,) the newest thing I play on it is Oblivion. (I'm working on a heavily modded-up Morrowind install, though, I'm curious to see whether that will end up being more of a workout for the system...)
I'm looking at boosting it to a Core 2 board in the near future; I've already got a PCIe GeForce 8400 something-or-other to go with it.
Nice to see another Elder Scrolls player :D
For AGP I could recommend an ATI Radeon HD3650, ive got one old 478 AGP 8x PC (no HT) with and 3.0GHz P4 and that AGP card, youd be surprised how much the poor old lady can run with that GFX card :)
Ive seen 3650s for good prices, tho lately AGP cards have risen quite a bit :/
But since your going PCI-E youll be better off :) You could pick up an Radeon 4870 or nvidia 260GTX for a really good price (Ive payed around 25-30$ for each) and with any dual core socket 775 CPU and that card you can run nearly all the latest games in low settings at least (Tried an E6300 overclocked @ 2,2GHz with an 260 GTX and it run both Skyrim and Borderlands in mid settings) under Windows XP.
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On somewhat new hardware XP is outdated yes, but if you are using older more performance limited hardware XP is more fitting then 7/8 (also much old hardware do not get drivers for new OS versions anymore).
I upgraded my 4 year old netbook from XP to 7 and now 8. I wouldn't put XP back on it. It's a 1.66mhz atom with 2gb of ram. I might drop to XP for something slower, but I might also put windows 2000 on it.
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My company uses all Windows 7 Pro 64-bit machines except for our phone PBX, which runs a custom embedded XP Pro. I think that's the only place you're likely to see XP in the future, i.e., I was at a Sheetz and noticed one of their food-ordering computers was rebooting, with an XP screen.
Tried Windows 8 and hated it, and it won't run some of our business-critical apps (SQL stuff, mostly), so that's a no-go!
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I upgraded my 4 year old netbook from XP to 7 and now 8. I wouldn't put XP back on it. It's a 1.66mhz atom with 2gb of ram. I might drop to XP for something slower, but I might also put windows 2000 on it.
That's not such and old machine compared to when XP was relaeased, I would have stayed on XP but I would have blown it free from the bloatware the OEM installation comes with, the stuff the manufacturer puts on their machines slows down loads more then people might think.
I would have installed a shrinked version of XP to make it fast but that's because I would not have any need of windows 7 or 8 on such a machine.
My wife has an similar spec'd Acer aspire One, it still has XP but not the OEM it came with and I replaced the HDD with an SSD which did loads, works good for her as a machine for webbrowsing when we travel :)
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I will use my Windows XP Professional 32 bit for four more months before I upgrade to Windows 7. I am doing that because I am waiting to save up enough to upgrade my CPU, upgrade my RAM, get a good video card and an entirely new HD, and get Windows 7 Professional 64 bit. I need to save up and squeeze another 2 to 3 years of my already 5 year old hardware before buying an entire new system hardware. Yes my hardware is at least 5 years old...I tend to drain out my hardware and software until I have no choice.
The biggest reason why I am upgrading to Windows 7 is because I have no choice. Ones Microsoft kills Windows XP I do not want to be in a vunerable stage of attack and hack and viruses. I have to upgrade to Windows 7 to protect myself and that is the only reason I am upgrading. Otherwise I will stick with Windows XP for as long as I can. The reason for that is because I already have all my files I need, customized my desktop, worked hard to fill up my favorite in the browser, have downloaded all the programs I need to enjoy my computer, I have made it MINE. I have made my Windows XP and my computer really MINE and it is only THANKS to Microsoft I am forced to get kicked out of my home (metaphorically speaking) and out in the street and now I have to get a new home.
THIS IS NOT FUN!
Backing up, not fun!
Downloading programs again not FUN!
Recustomizing my computer not FUN!
This whole experience makes me feel like I cannot keep my computer for me. That I have to make sure that I should prepare for the next move and that is NOT FUN!!
One of the biggest reasons why I loved Mac and Ubuntu is that you ARE NOT FORCED TO MOVE...just update and update and even change the entire UI by updating but you KEEP YOUR STUFF WITHOUT MOVING. You keep your customization, your security, everything...NOT FORCED to move every four years, every three years every five years....the feeling you cannot really open all your boxes anymore. You have to keep boxes closed for the next house move and that annoys me :(
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I will use my Windows XP Professional 32 bit for four more months before I upgrade to Windows 7. I am doing that because I am waiting to save up enough to upgrade my CPU, upgrade my RAM, get a good video card and an entirely new HD, and get Windows 7 Professional 64 bit. I need to save up and squeeze another 2 to 3 years of my already 5 year old hardware before buying an entire new system hardware. Yes my hardware is at least 5 years old...I tend to drain out my hardware and software until I have no choice.
The biggest reason why I am upgrading to Windows 7 is because I have no choice. Ones Microsoft kills Windows XP I do not want to be in a vunerable stage of attack and hack and viruses. I have to upgrade to Windows 7 to protect myself and that is the only reason I am upgrading. Otherwise I will stick with Windows XP for as long as I can. The reason for that is because I already have all my files I need, customized my desktop, worked hard to fill up my favorite in the browser, have downloaded all the programs I need to enjoy my computer, I have made it MINE. I have made my Windows XP and my computer really MINE and it is only THANKS to Microsoft I am forced to get kicked out of my home (metaphorically speaking) and out in the street and now I have to get a new home.
THIS IS NOT FUN!
Backing up, not fun!
Downloading programs again not FUN!
Recustomizing my computer not FUN!
This whole experience makes me feel like I cannot keep my computer for me. That I have to make sure that I should prepare for the next move and that is NOT FUN!!
One of the biggest reasons why I loved Mac and Ubuntu is that you ARE NOT FORCED TO MOVE...just update and update and even change the entire UI by updating but you KEEP YOUR STUFF WITHOUT MOVING. You keep your customization, your security, everything...NOT FORCED to move every four years, every three years every five years....the feeling you cannot really open all your boxes anymore. You have to keep boxes closed for the next house move and that annoys me :(
You know you can upgrade to Windows 7 and keep all your settings, files, favorites, program, background picture etc etc as it is right?
Pop in the Windows 7 DVD and pick upgrade instead of custom new installation, no files will dissapere and you will keep all but GUI as it was :)
Even if you need new hardware you can pop in the new hardware and keep your old harddrive with windows xp on, the upgrade will "repair" and add the new needed drivers and you will be safe.
About the backup part, I recommend everyone to make backup since you never know when your hard drive will bite the dust.
I myself have set up a server with 10x 2TB hard drives in mirror raid that backsup selected hard drives over the network once a month for me, it's set to backup my important drives from computers in the network, I highly recommend people to have some kind of backup system, all from CD/DVD's to flash storage or USB HDDS etc
If you got loads you want to keep backed up, an easier route then doing it like me with a server is using a NAS.
So don't worry you wont loose any files or programs and your settings will be saved :)
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Actually, XP is pretty dead.
If you have a CD that pre-date SP3, you've got to manually install SP3.
It doesn't always work correctly.
And in a little over a year, updates for SP3 stop.
A good run, but it about done.
I always install SP3 manually, never had any issues at all.
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It might have been said before, but the three big issues are lack of driver support for modern chips/devices, no 64 bit (xp64bit was a dead end, I did try it at the time it came out) and whats a lot of people disregard... security... XP was/is an open door.
So yes, unless you use it on very old hardware or virtual machines (*not* internet connected) ... it's dead Jim... dead...
Tom UK
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You know you can upgrade to Windows 7 and keep all your settings, files, favorites, program, background picture etc etc as it is right?
Pop in the Windows 7 DVD and pick upgrade instead of custom new installation, no files will dissapere and you will keep all but GUI as it was :)
Even if you need new hardware you can pop in the new hardware and keep your old harddrive with windows xp on, the upgrade will "repair" and add the new needed drivers and you will be safe.
About the backup part, I recommend everyone to make backup since you never know when your hard drive will bite the dust.
I myself have set up a server with 10x 2TB hard drives in mirror raid that backsup selected hard drives over the network once a month for me, it's set to backup my important drives from computers in the network, I highly recommend people to have some kind of backup system, all from CD/DVD's to flash storage or USB HDDS etc
If you got loads you want to keep backed up, an easier route then doing it like me with a server is using a NAS.
So don't worry you wont loose any files or programs and your settings will be saved :)
Really? You mean it? Hmm...maybe I should follow your advice and do a complete back up first before attempting the upgrade method. IT WOULD BE SUPER sweet if that is all I need to do without full blown format!! Oh the joy behind that!! :D :D :D
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Really? You mean it? Hmm...maybe I should follow your advice and do a complete back up first before attempting the upgrade method. IT WOULD BE SUPER sweet if that is all I need to do without full blown format!! Oh the joy behind that!! :D :D :D
Ill recommend you to use software to do an complete image of your drive so you keep your MBR etc, there are lots of free software but I usually use norton ghost :)
I wish you good luck, ask away when you are doing it if you need help, everything done right and you wont loose anything :)
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You know you can upgrade to Windows 7 and keep all your settings, files, favorites, program, background picture etc etc as it is right?
Pop in the Windows 7 DVD and pick upgrade instead of custom new installation, no files will dissapere and you will keep all but GUI as it was :)
No, this is not the case. You cannot "upgrade" from XP to 7. You can upgrade from Vista to 7, but cannot go from 32-bit to 64-bit. Also, I'd never recommend "upgrading" - you are much better starting clean.
There is a migration tool Microsoft has that backs up data & settings, which you then can use to restore after you do a clean install of Windows 7. But, if you're reasonably computer literate you can certainly copy off all that data manually and restore it when done, rather than trusting their tool to get everything you need.
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I use linux for most of my needs, but still keep a windows xp install on my main pc solely for video editing. I do everything I need in xp as far as that is concerned, so until my video editor no longer works with xp (and even then I may just not upgrade the vid editor software) xp is fine for me.
With every release of windows the hardware requirements become greater and greater... The os saps more and more of the pc's power away from the user, its kind of ridiculous.
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Nice to see another Elder Scrolls player :D
Mostly Morrowind, really. There's a lot I like about Oblivion - much better combat mechanics, f'rinstance, and technically gorgeous visuals - but it just really hasn't aged well. Too many elements dumbed-down, and some changes that were intended to make things better just made them worse. (Particularly the way the magic system replaces gradually lessened spell-failure chances with arbitrary "milestone" skill levels where you're allowed to cast better stuff, making all the skill levels in between feel pointless, and the leveled-difficulty system, which is clearly intended to keep you challenged but ends up making you feel increasingly frustrated as the difficulty rapidly outpaces your character development to the point where you have to pour like two dozen arrows into a single random bandit!) Plus, it just doesn't feel like as much of a world so much as just a generic fantasy playset, as compared to Morrowind's frankly alien landscape - partly because, like a lot of fantasy works, it looks pretty much like France, and partly because having fully-voiced dialogue means there's a lot less of it to flesh things out, because every line costs money :/
I'm told Skyrim is an improvement on most of those fronts, at least, but I never got out of the tutorial dungeon on account of my system's inability to handle it. Hopefully it'll have more of what I liked in Morrowind than Oblivion did...
But since your going PCI-E youll be better off :) You could pick up an Radeon 4870 or nvidia 260GTX for a really good price (Ive payed around 25-30$ for each) and with any dual core socket 775 CPU and that card you can run nearly all the latest games in low settings at least (Tried an E6300 overclocked @ 2,2GHz with an 260 GTX and it run both Skyrim and Borderlands in mid settings) under Windows XP.
Yeah...I don't mind AGP, really, but it's much harder to track down a Socket 775 board with AGP than it is to just go PCIe, and anyway I got the card on the cheap at the recycle center so it's no big deal. Just gotta get around to getting a board + CPU combo and then I can cannibalize the RAM and extra disk storage from my current Core 2 box (non-gaming, as it only has the one PCI slot! Stupid little micro-ATX boards...at least it was cheap.)
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Mostly Morrowind, really. There's a lot I like about Oblivion - much better combat mechanics, f'rinstance, and technically gorgeous visuals - but it just really hasn't aged well. Too many elements dumbed-down, and some changes that were intended to make things better just made them worse. (Particularly the way the magic system replaces gradually lessened spell-failure chances with arbitrary "milestone" skill levels where you're allowed to cast better stuff, making all the skill levels in between feel pointless, and the leveled-difficulty system, which is clearly intended to keep you challenged but ends up making you feel increasingly frustrated as the difficulty rapidly outpaces your character development to the point where you have to pour like two dozen arrows into a single random bandit!) Plus, it just doesn't feel like as much of a world so much as just a generic fantasy playset, as compared to Morrowind's frankly alien landscape - partly because, like a lot of fantasy works, it looks pretty much like France, and partly because having fully-voiced dialogue means there's a lot less of it to flesh things out, because every line costs money :/
I'm told Skyrim is an improvement on most of those fronts, at least, but I never got out of the tutorial dungeon on account of my system's inability to handle it. Hopefully it'll have more of what I liked in Morrowind than Oblivion did...
Yeah...I don't mind AGP, really, but it's much harder to track down a Socket 775 board with AGP than it is to just go PCIe, and anyway I got the card on the cheap at the recycle center so it's no big deal. Just gotta get around to getting a board + CPU combo and then I can cannibalize the RAM and extra disk storage from my current Core 2 box (non-gaming, as it only has the one PCI slot! Stupid little micro-ATX boards...at least it was cheap.)
Funny you should mention socket 775 :D I use socket 775 too! :)
Let us be honest, my hardware is of REALLY high end quality and the socket CPU 775 is NOT BAD CPU at all! It is these OSs that forces to get new hardware otherwise I am really comfortable with what I have if it wasn't for the lack of support that forces me to move really. Maybe I am getting old, I don't know...but it is really tiring.
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@AmigaClassicRule
when M$ stops supporting winXP, it wont become automatically open to all viruses. some people probably still use win2000, win95 and even older systems, those are probably as secure as win7. you will still be able to run thirdparty firewall and updated antivirus and other apps.
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I always install SP3 manually, never had any issues at all.
Way to go Clint.
Why don't you come over to my house and help me figure out why update won't work on the laptop I'm currently typing on after SP3 installation?
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Yes, it is dead as a door nail.
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when M$ stops supporting winXP, it wont become automatically open to all viruses. some people probably still use win2000, win95 and even older systems, those are probably as secure as win7. you will still be able to run thirdparty firewall and updated antivirus and other apps.
I've had exactly three virus infections in the fifteen years I've been using PCs, and all of them were on Windows versions which were still well inside their support window. It's all about good judgement and reasonable precautions on any system that faces the Internet, and third-party software can go a long way towards covering any holes that the OS vendor doesn't.
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Way to go Clint.
Why don't you come over to my house and help me figure out why update won't work on the laptop I'm currently typing on after SP3 installation?
Why don't you try another SP3, did you ever think you might have gotten a bad copy? The one I have is an ISO that I downloaded from the internet. I have never had a problem installing SP3, and I like XP, even though I run Linux on all my PC's. Like I said, I use it for WinUAE, simply because I like that emulator better than the ones offered in Linux format.
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No, this is not the case. You cannot "upgrade" from XP to 7. You can upgrade from Vista to 7, but cannot go from 32-bit to 64-bit. Also, I'd never recommend "upgrading" - you are much better starting clean.
There is a migration tool Microsoft has that backs up data & settings, which you then can use to restore after you do a clean install of Windows 7. But, if you're reasonably computer literate you can certainly copy off all that data manually and restore it when done, rather than trusting their tool to get everything you need.
He is right, forgot about upgrading to 64-bit, not possible to upgrade from 32-bit to 64-bit, but as he said you can use the migration tool since you do not want to upgrade to 32-bit W7 (need an iso of Vista first, upgrade without key then W7 upgrade works) :/
Mostly Morrowind, really. There's a lot I like about Oblivion - much better combat mechanics, f'rinstance, and technically gorgeous visuals - but it just really hasn't aged well. Too many elements dumbed-down, and some changes that were intended to make things better just made them worse. (Particularly the way the magic system replaces gradually lessened spell-failure chances with arbitrary "milestone" skill levels where you're allowed to cast better stuff, making all the skill levels in between feel pointless, and the leveled-difficulty system, which is clearly intended to keep you challenged but ends up making you feel increasingly frustrated as the difficulty rapidly outpaces your character development to the point where you have to pour like two dozen arrows into a single random bandit!) Plus, it just doesn't feel like as much of a world so much as just a generic fantasy playset, as compared to Morrowind's frankly alien landscape - partly because, like a lot of fantasy works, it looks pretty much like France, and partly because having fully-voiced dialogue means there's a lot less of it to flesh things out, because every line costs money :/
I'm told Skyrim is an improvement on most of those fronts, at least, but I never got out of the tutorial dungeon on account of my system's inability to handle it. Hopefully it'll have more of what I liked in Morrowind than Oblivion did...
Yeah...I don't mind AGP, really, but it's much harder to track down a Socket 775 board with AGP than it is to just go PCIe, and anyway I got the card on the cheap at the recycle center so it's no big deal. Just gotta get around to getting a board + CPU combo and then I can cannibalize the RAM and extra disk storage from my current Core 2 box (non-gaming, as it only has the one PCI slot! Stupid little micro-ATX boards...at least it was cheap.)
Well there are parts I like and not like with Skyrim, it's dumbed down but the world is beatifull! I like all the Elder Scrolls games in different ways, but Skyrim is the current one im playing :)
Good luck getting that 775 board, I see em getting tossed at nearest recycling center quite often, tho often OEM.
I wish you luck and hope you get a board and CPU, 775 CPU's have risen quite some in price if you look at the more high end ones, but the dual core E series are quite easy to get cheap!
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@AmigaClassicRule
when M$ stops supporting winXP, it wont become automatically open to all viruses. some people probably still use win2000, win95 and even older systems, those are probably as secure as win7. you will still be able to run thirdparty firewall and updated antivirus and other apps.
My biggest fear is that people will start taking control of my computer while I am deep at asleep at night. Right there I feel violated just thinking about. It is no different than someone breaking in to your home while you are sleeping, this is not a good feeling to have. That is why I am considering upgrading to Windows 7 to have an ease of mind when the time M$ pulls the plug on Windows XP.
Otherwise if it wasn't for this factor and if there where constant security updates for Windows XP I would have not even considered upgrading. I never loved Windows 8, never will, never will be and no amount of brain washing and shoving it down my mouth till I agree will happen....I love Windows XP for it's user interface (from many other reasons) and it is like Windows 98 and up and I am used to this interface for so long now...and I am so comfortable...I love having multiple Windows, I love shrinking maximizing windows, closing windows, opening more than one window and inside each window is an application, movie, etc...I like that a lot.....A LOT A LOT A LOT!! That is why Windows 7 is like Windows XP in steroid and I am happy to go for Windows 7 easy.
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My biggest fear is that people will start taking control of my computer while I am deep at asleep at night.
Why don't you just unplug your modem or router when you are not using it? That's what I do. It gets unplugged every evening before I go to bed and usually doesn't get plugged in again until I get home from work the next day and need to check the internet.
Hackers can't break into your computer if there is no connection to the outside world.
Shaves a few cents on your electricity bill as well (every little bit counts).
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Why don't you just unplug your modem or router when you are not using it? That's what I do. It gets unplugged every evening before I go to bed and usually doesn't get plugged in again until I get home from work the next day and need to check the internet.
Hackers can't break into your computer if there is no connection to the outside world.
Shaves a few cents on your electricity bill as well (every little bit counts).
That is an excellent idea.
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Why don't you try another SP3, did you ever think you might have gotten a bad copy? The one I have is an ISO that I downloaded from the internet. I have never had a problem installing SP3, and I like XP, even though I run Linux on all my PC's. Like I said, I use it for WinUAE, simply because I like that emulator better than the ones offered in Linux format.
Like I mentioned in my PM, I'd prefer to use legal copies of Windows.
Funny, Linux (these days) almost installs as easily as Windows.
You're right about WinUAE, every version of UAE ought to be that powerful.
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Why don't you just unplug your modem or router when you are not using it? That's what I do. It gets unplugged every evening before I go to bed and usually doesn't get plugged in again until I get home from work the next day and need to check the internet.
Hackers can't break into your computer if there is no connection to the outside world.
Shaves a few cents on your electricity bill as well (every little bit counts).
More simply, you can just disconnect from Windows (assuming you don't just go the even simpler route and shut the computer down when you're not using it. Suspend would work, too, assuming you don't have wake-on-LAN enabled, which you really shouldn't.) No cable-monkeying required.
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You know you can upgrade to Windows 7 and keep all your settings, files, favorites, program, background picture etc etc as it is right?
Pop in the Windows 7 DVD and pick upgrade instead of custom new installation, no files will dissapere and you will keep all but GUI as it was :)
You cannot do an in-place upgrade from XP to 7. You can upgrade from XP to Vista, then Vista to 7. Or, there's a program by LapLink called "PC Mover" which facilitates an in-place upgrade. It's pretty bad-ass and I've used it numerous times.
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More simply, you can just disconnect from Windows (assuming you don't just go the even simpler route and shut the computer down when you're not using it. Suspend would work, too, assuming you don't have wake-on-LAN enabled, which you really shouldn't.) No cable-monkeying required.
I will go with the route of turning off my computer when I go to bed. * sigh * I love Windows XP and 7, those two are really my favorite Windows OS ever existence in the history of Microsoft company. Even if I was tied to the chair and Windows 8 was forcefully shoved down my throat I will not like or loved it as I would for XP/7. This is something the Microsoft company can never have control over me with, they may control what software I use and force me to get new hardware, but they cannot control my love to a particular software or OS.
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There are many problems with Windows 8, the stupid legacy desktop, the lack of visual clues, etc. But if you use it every day it isn't horrible.
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Agree with you there acr.
Win8 is a serious suckfest.
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If you buy a new computer, you won't have a choice. Dell is forcing Windows 8 on everyone.
That's only for crap they sell at places like Best Buy. Dell's business line is still entirely available with Windows 7. Even they're not so stupid as to shoot themselves in the foot that badly! ;)
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Windows OS is broken. Every version. It has a nasty, faulty filesystem to start with: it has fragmentation problems I've NEVER experienced in any other OS I've used (and I've used a lot!).
It's unsecure, it degrades with use (wich is..just..so stupid I don't want to see it near me never again), why would you want to use such a piece of crap?
Do yourself a favor and install Lubuntu instead. No, NOT Ubuntu, but Lubuntu. It has low requeriments and it will work way better. It's way easier to use, really. My mother is 54 and she uses Lubuntu everyday (she never used or understood Amiga, for example).
Seriously, WHY Windows? Don't be so cruel with yourself.
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That is why Windows 7 is like Windows XP in steroid and I am happy to go for Windows 7 easy.
Windows 8 is Windows 7 on steroids. I never use the start screen and I don't miss the start menu. Other than that it's just better, but you're free to do what you want.
That's only for crap they sell at places like Best Buy. Dell's business line is still entirely available with Windows 7. Even they're not so stupid as to shoot themselves in the foot that badly! ;)
That isn't because people wouldn't like windows 8 though, that is because businesses have to buy machines that will run the software that keeps their business going. Keeping buggy custom applications working on new versions of an operating system can be tricky, that problem is not just limited to Windows. They might have worked on the previous version of the OS even though they weren't doing things right and any change could affect them. There were even bug fixes in Kickstart 2.04 that affected buggy 1.3 apps.
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Actually, XP is pretty dead.
If you have a CD that pre-date SP3, you've got to manually install SP3.
It doesn't always work correctly.
And in a little over a year, updates for SP3 stop.
A good run, but it about done.
You can slipstream SP3 into XP on a bootable CD. You've had to do that for a lot of motherboards since 2009 as they only Support XP SP3.
http://www.pcmech.com/article/slipstream-sp3-into-a-windows-xp-install-cd/
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You can slipstream SP3 into XP on a bootable CD. You've had to do that for a lot of motherboards since 2009 as they only Support XP SP3.
http://www.pcmech.com/article/slipstream-sp3-into-a-windows-xp-install-cd/
Yeah, I would always slip stream the service pack and do a fresh install anyway as it uses less disk space.
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Windows 8 is Windows 7 on steroids. I never use the start screen and I don't miss the start menu. Other than that it's just better, but you're free to do what you want.
That isn't because people wouldn't like windows 8 though, that is because businesses have to buy machines that will run the software that keeps their business going. Keeping custom applications working on new versions of an operating system without recompiling can be tricky, that problem is not just limited to Windows.
?? You don't have to recompile anything for Windows 8. It's the same base version of Windows as Windows 7 and Vista. (6.0, 6.1 and 6.2.)
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Windows OS is broken. Every version. It has a nasty, faulty filesystem to start with: it has fragmentation problems I've NEVER experienced in any other OS I've used (and I've used a lot!).
It's unsecure, it degrades with use (wich is..just..so stupid I don't want to see it near me never again), why would you want to use such a piece of crap?
Do yourself a favor and install Lubuntu instead. No, NOT Ubuntu, but Lubuntu. It has low requeriments and it will work way better. It's way easier to use, really. My mother is 54 and she uses Lubuntu everyday (she never used or understood Amiga, for example).
Seriously, WHY Windows? Don't be so cruel with yourself.
I've used lots of operating systems as well. NTFS is a fine file system, As to fragmentation yes 15 years ago, (It used to be called checker boarding on Unix and Linux and older OSes)
As to security I've had a vanilla XP SP laptop with no AV software or security patches connected directly to my external router for 3 years now Std XP Firewall on (Which I use for torrent work).
I've never tried Lubuntu. But the same laptop I spoke of used to be Ubuntu 10 for a little while but it kept freezing on boot randomly.
Good luck to your Mum. Sounds like Lubuntu is useful which is the main thing.
I use Windows because I want to do modern things like encode bluray DVDs and Edit and work with high definition video. I can't do that with any other OS and when I can its at half the speed I can with my Windows/Intel rig.
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dead ..well i went from 98 to xp ..have it on both machines ..old pent400
an my i3 machine..i will have to upgrade ..my xp discs wont install any more ..microsoft thinks ive used it enuff ...yes i did buy it ...when i went to activate it got a message that the software has been used to much basically ..an i cant activate it again ..prob stick with xp..just use a cracked copy ..
in my opinion its wrong to disable software that u have paid for an use ..then again its microsoft ..what choice do i have..
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dead ..well i went from 98 to xp ..have it on both machines ..old pent400
an my i3 machine..i will have to upgrade ..my xp discs wont install any more ..microsoft thinks ive used it enuff ...yes i did buy it ...when i went to activate it got a message that the software has been used to much basically ..an i cant activate it again ..prob stick with xp..just use a cracked copy ..
in my opinion its wrong to disable software that u have paid for an use ..then again its microsoft ..what choice do i have..
Good point there I never thought of it before. Microsoft goes at everyone's head and attacking people about pirating their OS all the time. Well, isn't Microsoft stealing from people too? I mean when you buy a product what gives the company right to come to your home, disable your product so that you are forced to buy the newer model? This is after all YOUR PRODUCT!! THIS IS AFTER ALL YOUR ITEM!! Well, isn't Microsoft doing that? Isn't Microsoft stealing from millions and millions of people every time by no longer supporting their products and forcing people to get rid of their Windows and must buy the newer model? Shouldn't people have choices and not be dragged like sheep with chains around theirs necks to buy the new product?
What happened to our freedom of choice? Sure technically speaking you can just stay with what you have but if you think about it...you are eventually GOING TO BE FORCED to buy whatever Microsoft send your way and like it. As you can see some people LOVE Windows 8...so in the end you are "slave" of Microsoft. You have no choice. You are stuck with what ever Microsoft send you, you are going to upgrade it, you are going to like it, you are going to love it, only because I tell you too. When you buy my Windows it is not yours, it is mine, I can do what the heck with it, your money belongs to me now. That is pretty much what is happening with Microsoft and Windows.
If Windows is really, really, really yours it will not expire like food at a certain amount of years. I mean look at Windows 7, it is only 3.5 years old it is just a baby before Windows 8 came out and now you will eventually MUST upgrade to Windows 8 making Windows 7 leading redundancy.
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Xp can be very secure. Computer security is as much a question of user behavior as patching the security flaws of the OS. Don't go to pirate or porn sites, don't open email attachements from strangers and even friends sometimes, be careful about the software you put on your computer and you have won more than half the security battle. Put in a good firewall and antivirus on top of this and run your computer in user mode and you're pretty safe from most threats. If you really know your ntfs file permissions, you can improve on the pretty lame default settings that come with the OS and set it up so where files are written, they can't be executed and where they are executed, they can't be written to in user mode and you have a pretty tight system. I do all of this and image my system partitions on 5 laptops running Xp Pro. I've had no malware in over 10 years and the few times I've had to restore the system from an image, it was due to a hardware change or upgrade or software install messing things up.
Xp will live on for years to come. Operating systems don't die, they just slowly--so very slowly--fade away. In the pretty much faded out catagory I would put Windows 95, Windows NT4, OS2, Mac OS 9 and earlier and OSX through Jaguar. Windows 98 and Tiger still linger. Windows 2000 is pretty faded because it was delivered late and quickly replaced by Xp which is essentially an improved version of Win2k. MSDOS survives in a hardware niche for those of us that use it for such things as ROM burners.
I never upgrade the OS on an old machine. I get a new machine designed for the new OS. I can't give up Xp because I need it to run my very expensive printer and scanner combo that isn't supported beyond Xp. This qualifies as a business use. I will be running print jobs with Xp long after 2014 barring natural disasters destroying everything I've got.
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Well, isn't Microsoft stealing from people too? I mean when you buy a product what gives the company right to come to your home, disable your product so that you are forced to buy the newer model?
They don't do that. If you have an old computer running XP today then it will still work in the future. Although it is the first OS that had to be activated online, so it will be interesting what they do about allowing new installs.
They might do what Adobe recently did with Creative Suite 2 and put out a new version that no longer requires activation.
Providing security updates is another matter.
I never upgrade the OS on an old machine. I get a new machine designed for the new OS. I can't give up Xp because I need it to run my very expensive printer and scanner combo that isn't supported beyond Xp. This qualifies as a business use. I will be running print jobs with Xp long after 2014 barring natural disasters destroying everything I've got.
My five year old laptop came with Vista, I upgraded to 7 and now 8 & it runs fine. Old hardware can be a problem, as long as your hardware came with a vista 32 & 64 bit driver then it's likely to be supported by 7 & 8. But hardware from XP or earlier can be a problem, I used XP mode for testing some old hardware before selling it. Driver support in Linux or MacOS is worse though.
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Seriously, WHY Windows? Don't be so cruel with yourself.
Why Windows? Maybe because it doesn't make me want to slit my wrists with dependency hell and terrible UI...
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My five year old laptop came with Vista, I upgraded to 7 and now 8 & it runs fine. Old hardware can be a problem, as long as your hardware came with a vista 32 & 64 bit driver then it's likely to be supported by 7 & 8. But hardware from XP or earlier can be a problem, I used XP mode for testing some old hardware before selling it. Driver support in Linux or MacOS is worse though.
It's not a question of will it work or not. It already works well with what it has and the hardware geek in me would rather buy new hardware than mess around with an OS upgrade. I'm also a creature of habit and don't like to have to readjust to a new OS until it's necessary. Even with the Amiga, I'm mostly using OS 3.1 even though I've got a working install of OS 3.9 on another partition in my A4000. I mostly use OS 3.9 for unpacking .lzh files but if I'm just going to turn on the Toaster or use Deluxe Paint or ImageFX, I just boot to 3.1. It boots faster and does most of what I need. My Amigas are mostly used for custom graphic work and I don't need much of what the newer versions of Amiga OS have. I have a Sony Vaio for sound and video and the rest are all IBM/Lenovo Thinkpads--some of the same models that are used on the International space station. Nasa is an entity that is slow to upgrade. This isn't something exclusive to Amigans.
And for the laptop that I use for business which involves a lot of writing, email, printing and scanning, I'm really cautious and conservative and don't install new software very often, much less a new OS.
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And for the laptop that I use for business which involves a lot of writing, email, printing and scanning, I'm really cautious and conservative and don't install new software very often, much less a new OS.
I tend to buy a new hard drive when doing upgrades for that reason. Then you can install all the software you need but switch back to do some real work.
Usually I'm ready for a new drive by the time the new OS comes out anyway.
I would like new hardware, because this laptop is now quite low powered. It's a 2.5 C2D with an NVidia 8600. In Windows 8 it scores 6.2 for processor and ram, 5.9 for the 1tb WDC drive, with the lowest score of 5.5/5.6 for the graphics/gaming graphics.
I tend to always install the latest of everything, although I've never looked at OS3.5/OS3.9.
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Xp can be very secure. Computer security is as much a question of user behavior as patching the security flaws of the OS. Don't go to pirate or porn sites, don't open email attachements from strangers and even friends sometimes, be careful about the software you put on your computer and you have won more than half the security battle. Put in a good firewall and antivirus on top of this and run your computer in user mode and you're pretty safe from most threats. If you really know your ntfs file permissions, you can improve on the pretty lame default settings that come with the OS and set it up so where files are written, they can't be executed and where they are executed, they can't be written to in user mode and you have a pretty tight system. I do all of this and image my system partitions on 5 laptops running Xp Pro. I've had no malware in over 10 years and the few times I've had to restore the system from an image, it was due to a hardware change or upgrade or software install messing things up.
Xp will live on for years to come. Operating systems don't die, they just slowly--so very slowly--fade away. In the pretty much faded out catagory I would put Windows 95, Windows NT4, OS2, Mac OS 9 and earlier and OSX through Jaguar. Windows 98 and Tiger still linger. Windows 2000 is pretty faded because it was delivered late and quickly replaced by Xp which is essentially an improved version of Win2k. MSDOS survives in a hardware niche for those of us that use it for such things as ROM burners.
I never upgrade the OS on an old machine. I get a new machine designed for the new OS. I can't give up Xp because I need it to run my very expensive printer and scanner combo that isn't supported beyond Xp. This qualifies as a business use. I will be running print jobs with Xp long after 2014 barring natural disasters destroying everything I've got.
Hey, can you give me the steps and software I need (if possible) in case for some reason I am unable to upgrade OS by the end of 2014 and I am still stuck using Windows XP for another year or so, to protect my computer from hackers, viruses, etc? (I like the NTFS, thingy) As long as I am not forced to reformat my HD or install Windows again.
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That is a bit much for one post, but here is the esseence of it. This is not something I came up with. I got it from a US Navy manual on securing computer systems running WinNT 4.0. In the ntfs file system of the time, file permissions were much simpler than in the current version but the basic principle still holds and was modeled on file permissions in UNIX systems.
To set file permissions manually in Windows Xp, you need the Pro version. In the tools menu in explorer select folder options and select the view tab. At the bottom of the menu deselect "Use Simple File Sharing". You will now be able to manually set file permissions on any level from a whole drive to a single file. You do this by right clicking on the file or folder you want to set permissions on in explorer. The permissions are set in the security tab. This is the easy part, setting the permissions and getting them right is complicated in ntfs. I never use deny. The basic structure for a file or folder I want to have executible files in is full control for admistrator and system and users get read and execute, list folder contents, and read. The folders that get this permission are Windows and Program Files. All the other folders are set to read/list folder contents/write/delete. Delete permissions are set in the advanced tab. You also have to reset permissions on all child objects in the advanced menu to change permissions on the contents of the subfolders and files. I also delete all users and groups except Adminstrators, system, users, and power users. There is a default "everyone" group that will override everything unless you delete it.
I wouldn't recommend doing this on your main system until you get a feel for it. It will take some trial and error to get it right and some software won't work without further file permission tweaking. Microsoft made this way to complicated as far as I'm concerned. In a Unix/linux system, all there is is read, write and execute in 3 groups and that is all you need.
Doing this makes a system more secure but much less convenient. That is the trade off. It is satisfying to see an error message because some piece of malware is trying to write itself into a protected area but it also means that you have to log on as an administrator--or run an installation program as an administrator--to install software.
You won't need to reformat your driver or reinstall your system but it might be a good idea to repartition your system into seperate system and data partitions if you want to use imaging software and image your system. The best imaging and partitioning software that I've found for free is the Easus suite. Imaging is a the best way to back a system up. I started doing it after losing days of my time trying to get a system to work right and trying to trace down what piece of software or what registry entry messed things up. It is much simpler not to even try and wait a few minutes as the image of the system is restored. The built in system restore in Xp will work in most cases pretty well but imaging is better.
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dead ..well i went from 98 to xp ..have it on both machines ..old pent400
an my i3 machine..i will have to upgrade ..my xp discs wont install any more ..microsoft thinks ive used it enuff ...yes i did buy it ...when i went to activate it got a message that the software has been used to much basically ..an i cant activate it again ..prob stick with xp..just use a cracked copy ..
in my opinion its wrong to disable software that u have paid for an use ..then again its microsoft ..what choice do i have..
Not saying that this isn't a pain in the arse, but I'm pretty sure you can call Microsoft in these instances and get it reactivated.
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This is after all YOUR PRODUCT!! THIS IS AFTER ALL YOUR ITEM!!
Uummm, no. Developing the products that Microsoft does requires millions/billions of dollars. Do you really think you are buying the product for $200 if they've spent billions to create it?!?! You're not buying the product. If you were, you would never be getting any future updates. It would be stuck in its current state at the time you bought it. Think about buying a car. Same thing. Well, maybe that's not a good example since car companies spend billions to develop vehicles. Anyway, in the case of software, you're not buying the product. You are buying a _license_ to use the product. As such, they are free to change the product to suit new needs. That's how the majority of software in existence works.
Back on the real topic, I still use Windows XP for most of my VM's (virtual machines) on my home media server. Great to test out new and/or downloaded software that way without worry of infecting the real, physical machine. Also run my web server (non-Windows) in a VM. Set its imported share to read-only so if the web server gets hacked, the contents cannot be trashed.