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The "Not Quite Amiga but still computer related category" => Amiga Emulation => Topic started by: Helgis75 on March 30, 2003, 09:12:33 PM

Title: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Helgis75 on March 30, 2003, 09:12:33 PM
Check it out at the topic from SlimJim. The report from the AmiGBG 2003. Alan revealed the future of the AmigaOne!!! Impressive stuffs i have to say!

Better check it out, and Eyetech have shipped the boards to customers after that show, so we should have them SOON!!!!  :-)  :-)  :-)  :-)  :-)  :-D  :-D  :-D  :-D

Impressive works, Eyetech, Hyperion and Mai!!! Keep it going!!! :-D  :-D  :-D  :-D

God, about TIME!  :-)
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: z5 on March 30, 2003, 09:21:30 PM
How come i always know from the title that it will be something posted by Helgis?
 :-P
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: takemehomegrandma on March 30, 2003, 11:01:42 PM
 :-D
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: SlimJim on March 30, 2003, 11:03:24 PM
@z5
 
:-D
 
@Helgis
 
Yes, it's good news. Let's hope now that the boards arrive
quickly and safely to pre-orderers. There are also good
hintings about AOS4 (see Rogue's comments elsewhere,
as well as fleecys Q&A this week). It might very well be
running -emulation and all- on CSPPC as we speak. How
well tested it is at this point is anyones guess though.
Here's hoping.
.
SlimJim
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Warrent on March 31, 2003, 03:54:10 AM
Yes, the SlimJim report was nice to read.  I am hoping that is true about the boards being shipped to the customers after the show, that would mean I may see mine in a couple of weeeks:-)  I also am hoping that Alan would give an update or confrim the shipping of the boards.  All in all it sounds like things are moving in the right direction :-)  Here is hoping that we will see more good news about the Amigaone and OS 4.
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Warface on March 31, 2003, 08:54:15 AM
Oh my... Having to listen to the depressed bickering then fanatic applauding from the same persons is a bit tiring at sometimes... Yet, understandable. Good that you have something to believe in again. And sad that it goes away time to time..
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: olegil on March 31, 2003, 09:31:10 AM
I must say I got a good feeling from Alan's A1 roadmap.
I am thinking of building my own SE board into a 1U rack unit, but I think it would be a tight squeeze with the new memory module I bought from Gunne this weekend.

However, I can see these as good selling points for the AmigaOne:

The firmware (U-Boot) will use serial port for stdin/stdout if you set the environment variables stdin/stdout to serial OR you remove the keyboard/vga card (autodetects...). Thus, you don't need a VGA card or a keyboard for a render-farm.

It has 66MHz PCI if you have a RAID controller or a gigabit ethernet card. Running in a 1U rack box without VGA but with IDE/SCSI RAID or GBE would make for quite a nice server, actually.

It uses hardly ANY power. 3W for the 750FX CPU? Dang, man. Might as well be zero when you compare to other platforms.

Look out for a 1U amigaone coming to a rack near you :-)


Addendum:

Check out a 32x32 RS232 crosspoint matrix here:
Network Electronics website, D3232 product page (http://www.network-electronics.com/default.asp?cat=60&id=355)

Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Hooligan_DCS on March 31, 2003, 09:41:44 AM
Challenges: FUD

I don't know what Alan's talking about  :-D
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: JurassicCamper on March 31, 2003, 10:21:33 AM
@ SlimJim / Alan / Anybody who may know.

As you are the only person who has posted a show report so far could you clarify something. It may not have even been mentioned.

If the board were stuck in Germany on Saturday and GGS data are expected to have them on Monday(Today). Does that mean that GGS has got all the first batch ? One would assume they would go to England first to be serialised etc, before being sent on, unless this has been done by the third party QA company already. It  also save eyetech the cost of having to reship them on.
Do you think its fair to assume that several bundles have been sent out from the 3rd party QA Eg:-
Batch for Eyetech
Batch for GGS

etc etc :-?  :-?  :-?  :nervous:
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: olegil on March 31, 2003, 10:34:12 AM
What I remember from Alan's speech:
The boards was in Germany on friday and is expected to Eyetech today. Gunne should have his on wednesday, I think.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think it's basically just a bunch of crates, one of which happens to include the excact number of boards Gunne needs so Alan redirect it easily. I think all boards go by England on the way due to some customs thingie. Unfortunately.
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Helgis75 on March 31, 2003, 10:40:59 AM
One of the most impressive news Alan told was the plan for the MicroATX-based AmigaOne-XE, with ATA133Mhz RAID-support and GigaWire. At the moment the AGP is still x2, but it's possible that such a board like this will have the Artica P when it's completed. Anyway, i was very impressed!!!  :-)

Well, as i see from some of you telling here. German stores may have got their boards by today, and Gunne will have them by wednesday, i think. By friday i guess Datakompaniet in Norway may get them in. I expect to get my A1G4XE mobo sometime the second week of April:-) Very exciting, indeed!!!
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: SlimJim on March 31, 2003, 10:43:18 AM
@Jurassic Camper
 
Yes, you are correct. I confused this issue slightly. Shipment
*to* GGS will begin monday, and GGS will have it like,
wednesdayish.
.
SlimJim
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Juzz on March 31, 2003, 10:49:19 AM
Quote
Well, as i see from some of you telling here. German stores may have got their boards by today,

Nopes - the boards were stuck in UPS...
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Helgis75 on March 31, 2003, 10:52:41 AM
I was posting a mail to Datakompaniet where i told them about the show. I made a copy of the report, so they read it. I was told that they could expect to have the boards just before Easter!!! :-)  :-)  :-)  :-)  :-)  :-D  :-D

Very good news, really! The wait is finally over!!! :-)
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: odin on March 31, 2003, 11:27:17 AM
Quote

Helgis75 wrote:

Very good news, really! The wait is finally over!!! :-)


No it's not! The OS these boards were built for still isn't here :-p.
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Hooligan_DCS on March 31, 2003, 12:16:47 PM
Quote

odin wrote:
Quote

Helgis75 wrote:

Very good news, really! The wait is finally over!!! :-)


No it's not! The OS these boards were built for still isn't here :-p.


Don't spoil his day and good spirit now ... let's forget the whole OS4 .. seems like it's not THAT important anyway. As long as we have lots of A1's out there seems to satisfy a lot of people.
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: JurassicCamper on March 31, 2003, 12:42:06 PM
Quote

... let's forget the whole OS4 .. seems like it's not THAT important anyway. As long as we have lots of A1's out there seems to satisfy a lot of people.


I think most people will be happy just to get the hardware for now.
I realy do think it will put a breath of fresh air into the postings over the next few weeks as we all start helping each other out with linux and A1 experiences.

Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: poweramiga2002 on March 31, 2003, 01:26:54 PM
I agree about getting the A1 first wont matter too much as well be spending many weeks to months playing with our new hardware then os4 will arrive then we spend many years playing with our new hardware with our new os cant think of any other way of spending my time thats true quality time just me and my A1 if the other half will let me
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Helgis75 on March 31, 2003, 01:39:04 PM
Yep, it's most important to get the AmigaOne motherboards. No matter when we get the OS4 as long as we can have the wonders of LinuxPPC, as well as being able to run MOL (Mac On Linux)!  :-D

I happy to see that i will get my A1G4XE mobo soon!  :-)
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: olegil on March 31, 2003, 01:56:37 PM
@Helgis75:

Well, good luck. The boards were in (Cologne/Køln/Köln, depending on your language) on friday, England hopefully today, Sweden possibly on wednesday, and then should reach Datakompaniet a few days after that (remember that getting them past Norwegian customs take another day or two at least, so maybe 3-4 working days...)
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: olegil on March 31, 2003, 01:57:57 PM
Helgis, I just have to ask. Where you there after all, or have you only read the short version from SlimJims report?
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: poweramiga2002 on March 31, 2003, 02:00:19 PM
Well, good luck. The boards were in (Cologne/Køln/Köln, depending on your language) on friday, England hopefully today, Sweden possibly on wednesday, and then should reach Datakompaniet a few days after that


I only want to know when they can get to Australia goto move my ppc A1200 out of the way
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: JurassicCamper on March 31, 2003, 02:41:11 PM
If you listen to the Alans mp3 between 6:35 & 10:00 mins is the delivery time scale.
He mentions the contract  with the QA people is to test the boards by the 31st March (Today) and then 1 weeks shipping to England. So it looks like they will be leaving for England today. However, Alan expects a batch today from UPS, but only mentions GGS, not. how many are in it. But you must remember the target audience were swedish.

Who's bloody dog kept barking in the background ?
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Hooligan_DCS on March 31, 2003, 02:45:25 PM
Quote
I agree about getting the A1 first wont matter too much as well be spending many weeks to months playing with our new hardware


What new hardware? A1 mobo is made of pretty much industry standard components. You can play with the nice dongle, thats not industry standard :-)

How blind are people not to see that A1 mobo is nothing special and OS4 will be the driving force. I couldn't care less if it ran on intel and on parts purchable from store next door.
Sometimes I wonder if some Amiga-people have even touched a computer above the 233mhz barrier, or seen the performance of even a MIDDLE-tech PC these days.
But hey, if playing with Linux makes you happy, what the heck. Go for it.

It's like I'd be wooing and wheeing over Pegasos 1 mobo. I already know it's outdated, I already know it will be slow in certain areas. I know I could have a far more superior machine with the same price. What I want to try is MOS, and thats for hobby. #### the hardware.
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: SlimJim on March 31, 2003, 03:06:18 PM
@Hooligan
 
Oh, come on now. You know very well people are excited,
not of the prospect of running Linux, but knowing that this
is the board that will run AOS4 in a (hopefully close)
future. Sort of having the first part of a two-part package
(although I agree AOS4 is the bigger part).
 We all know (probably Helgis too :-P) that the hardware in
itself is outdated compared to a modern PC. But being
hardware running AOS, it's not outdated - it's the top of
the line.
 
Stop being a spoil sport for once and let people have their
fun. ;-)
.
SlimJim
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Kronos on March 31, 2003, 03:10:51 PM
@olegil

3W for the CPU si nice, but what does the whole mobo take ?

Looking at the layout of the "old" A1, I would guess more than
a Cyrix or Transmeta  based mobo.

Also, people buying servers don't buy servers, they buy trust,
which are they more likely to find in the big names.

Someone buying a renderfarm would also have lots of options.

About the boards being stuck in Cologne :

Oh well, there really seems to be hell of bad luck goming
with the name. Final proove of the "Amiga-curse" ?
  :-o
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Hooligan_DCS on March 31, 2003, 03:34:02 PM
@SlimJim

I am letting them have fun. I am just wondering.. can I wonder. I like wondering. Please?  :-)

But as I said, I am not excited about Pegasos1 mobo (hopefully get it this week), I want to try out MOS. The same goes for A1. Maybe I have tried way too many computers in past 20 years and become sceptical.. I don't know. It's hard to explain I quess.. but I am amazed after all these years that we have waited for a 'completely' new OS for Amiga, people go nuts about one lousy (overpriced) motherboard.

As for my hobby, so far it's been about the OS, not about the hardware. I hate Paula, I hate AGA, I hate the slow chipmem etc. In fact there is not much good in Amiga hardware at all that I'd say I love, but damn, I love the AmigaOS.
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Coder on March 31, 2003, 03:56:37 PM
@Kronos

Quote
About the boards being stuck in Cologne.....


Hmmm your work Kronos? :-D

Coder
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: vortexau on March 31, 2003, 04:23:55 PM
@those so highly critical of the (to them) "expensive, out-dated mobo":

During my 30 years of motorcycling, I NEVER bought a really-fast chain-driven machine!

I DID own three OHV BMWs, one highly-detuned Moto Guzzi Tourer, and one half-litre V-twin Honda. The BMWs and the Moto Guzzi were ALL recognized as having engines FAR from up-to-date technology! In addition, these were HIGHER-priced than contempory Japanese 250kph+ machinery.

And you know what? I didn't give a damm! I bought these bikes because I wanted to! Chain-driven stuff didn't appeal to me at all!

. . . . . . . . . . .

I'm well aware that x86-tech has sky-rocketed up in speed, and sunk in price, and you know what? I don't give a damm about that either! If ANY of this stuff had appealed to ME I would have bought at least ONE!

NONE appeal to me any more than chain-driven speed-bikes ......

AOS on x86 would NOT attract applications, any more than BeOS did!
Linux runs on PLENTY of x86 boxes - WHERE are ALL THOSE WONDERFUL Linux Games?

Do you see a pattern here? Other OS' run on x86 - Developers code for Windows!

EXACTLY the same thing happened after the release of the C128.
WHY make Apps for the C128 (specifically) when C64 Apps would run on C128s AND on C64s!

WHY is MAC OS not on X86? Same reason! Move on!

. . . . . . . . . . . .

Two classes of Amiga Users: Present and Former.
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: olegil on March 31, 2003, 04:28:54 PM
Could you point out the huge powerdrains you see in the SE design? I don't see them glowing red hot here on my board, maybe you could tell me? ;-)
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: olegil on March 31, 2003, 04:34:06 PM
@JurassicCamper:

The package for GGS was sent with UPS because of the show. Imagine the let-down when UPS didn't have it in England when Alan drove a long way to pick them up on friday.

GGS bought about 30 boards, 7 of which will end up with Datakompaniet. It would cost too much to send ALL the boards like that, so the rest will come in about a week.

Oh, and to everyone:
I saw someone making criticism about external Q&A and excuses and stuff. The big thing about external Q&A isn't that it's external, it's that it is in the same country as the production plant. That helps a lot when they have to ship boards back and forth between factory and testing... I know, because I'm in the R&D department at work and see this all the time...
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Kronos on March 31, 2003, 04:34:54 PM
@olegil

The SE has looooooots of small parts (/me lacks the right word
for NOT intregrated circuit, discret ?), these will allways
use more power compared to an IC.

AFAIK 17W is what the whole Pegasos-mobo with CPU takes, and I've
heard of mini-ATX/ITX mobos going even lower.

@coder

A men gotta do what a men gotta do  :-P
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Warface on March 31, 2003, 07:35:23 PM
Beware of the clown, I tell you :-)
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: mikeymike on March 31, 2003, 07:48:10 PM
Helgis, would you mind toning your mindless optimism down quite a few notches?  It's thoroughly depressing to think that anyone could still have your viewpoint on things after about ten years of waiting for something NEW.  And then add to that the amount of delays of getting A1 XEs to ship even without the operating system we all want on it.

I'm glad I decided to wait until OS4 is at least released (I want to see it in action first) before thinking about getting an A1, I don't know how unbelievably pee'd off I would be if I had gone for the earlybird offers!  I would have probably had several seisures by now!
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Helgis75 on March 31, 2003, 08:06:16 PM
Quote

mikeymike wrote:
Helgis, would you mind toning your mindless optimism down quite a few notches?  It's thoroughly depressing to think that anyone could still have your viewpoint on things after about ten years of waiting for something NEW.  And then add to that the amount of delays of getting A1 XEs to ship even without the operating system we all want on it.

I'm glad I decided to wait until OS4 is at least released (I want to see it in action first) before thinking about getting an A1, I don't know how unbelievably pee'd off I would be if I had gone for the earlybird offers!  I would have probably had several seisures by now!



Why should i be less optimistic? I don't care about what you might say. Most people feel more than happy enough to get the boards, and having the option to run LinuxPPC is a clear reason. It's to expand the software base for AmigaOS 4. If you want to wait, then fine. Most people are more than tired enough of waiting. I know for sure that i will have a motherboard in fully working condition, and being just powerful and exciting! I don't mind running Debian Linux as first...I think you sound a bit jealous, but listen up..i don't care for your comments, and i guess nobody else does...So, good luck with your choice...but we don't need your negative comments.

And you may know that two other new AmigaOne-motherboards are under development. The A1G3Lite and a microATX-formed AmigaOne with ATA133 RAID support and Gigawire, among other things..

Now you get the picture..
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Warface on March 31, 2003, 08:29:07 PM
Quote
microATX-formed AmigaOne


Sometimes I wonder how far technology evolves... Just kidding. :-)
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: mikeymike on March 31, 2003, 08:47:49 PM
@ Helgis75
Quote
I don't care about what you might say.

Well I guess that's that then.  Oh no, apparently not.

Jealousy?  What's there to be jealous of?  To me that's not an Amiga until it runs AmigaOS.  To me it may as well be an x86 box with a Celeron in running Linux, aka.  "throroughly unremarkable".  Until OS4 is released.  

As far as "we don't need your negative comments", is your hope that desperate that it can't take a little bit of balloon popping from the reality squad?

Be as hopeful as you like, I don't mind that in the slightest.  However, in a public forum, please try to be a bit more objective and realistic in your expression.  If I maintained anywhere near the amount of optimism and happy-happy-joy-joy over every little piece of news and non-news regarding Amiga as you do, and expressed that to my [non Amiga fan] friends, they would have probably killed me by now!  Even now I have to keep my trap shut because in reality, as far as solid new product offerings go, I have nothing to talk about!
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: alx on March 31, 2003, 08:49:15 PM
Could a micro-ATX board fit in an A500/1200 style console case?
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: mikeymike on March 31, 2003, 08:51:56 PM
@ alx

With the aid of cutting equipment, quite a few new screw-hole mounting points, and a general cannabilism of the inside of the case, perhaps :-)

More likely an A500 though, the A1200 isn't that deep.

But even then, why would you want to?  You'd have to throw out or adapter-ize 99% of the inputs between things like keyboard, drives, etc in order to manage it, and in the end you're only putting an x86 motherboard into a plastic case that says Amiga on it :-)
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: dammy on March 31, 2003, 08:53:04 PM
by vortexau on 2003/3/31 10:23:55

Quote
AOS on x86 would NOT attract applications, any more than BeOS did!
Linux runs on PLENTY of x86 boxes - WHERE are ALL THOSE WONDERFUL Linux Games?


BeOS is apparently making a commercial come back.  BeOS' problem was not that it went to X86 (it actually increased it's user base), but it was preasure of the IPO and desperate jump to embedded OS that lead management to screw up a decent OS.  As for games, what cutting edge games are out for Macs?  If you think just because MOS/OS4 runs on PPC, your going to get games, you got another thought coming.

Quote
Do you see a pattern here? Other OS' run on x86 - Developers code for Windows!


And Linux, and BSD, and BeOS, and AROS, and Symbian OS, and all the other OSs (like OSX ;-) .

Quote
WHY is MAC OS not on X86? Same reason! Move on!


Hate to break it to you, but Apple has maintained OSX on x86 for years.  Gee, wonder why Apple is spending R&D cash on maintaining a x86 port?  

Dammy
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Hattig on March 31, 2003, 08:56:54 PM
Quote
Hate to break it to you, but Apple has maintained OSX on x86 for years. Gee, wonder why Apple is spending R&D cash on maintaining a x86 port?


To ensure a clean code base, and nothing more. It only has drivers for one 4 year old Intel chipset, 440BX.

Apple will never move to any variant of x86, or x86-64.
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Hooligan_DCS on March 31, 2003, 09:20:06 PM
Quote

mikeymike wrote:
@ Helgis75
Quote
I don't care about what you might say.

Well I guess that's that then.  Oh no, apparently not.

Jealousy?  What's there to be jealous of?  To me that's not an Amiga until it runs AmigaOS.  To me it may as well be an x86 box with a Celeron in running Linux, aka.  "throroughly unremarkable".  Until OS4 is released.  

As far as "we don't need your negative comments", is your hope that desperate that it can't take a little bit of balloon popping from the reality squad?

Be as hopeful as you like, I don't mind that in the slightest.  However, in a public forum, please try to be a bit more objective and realistic in your expression.  If I maintained anywhere near the amount of optimism and happy-happy-joy-joy over every little piece of news and non-news regarding Amiga as you do, and expressed that to my [non Amiga fan] friends, they would have probably killed me by now!  Even now I have to keep my trap shut because in reality, as far as solid new product offerings go, I have nothing to talk about!


We have pretty much the same thoughts. Are we long lost brothers?  ;-)
Thats what I have been trying to cry out loud for ages: A1 is nothing but overpriced  Linux box until OS4 is running on it. And thats a fact no-one can change, not even Mr.Helgis.
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: olegil on March 31, 2003, 09:59:19 PM
Quote

JurassicCamper wrote:
Who's bloody dog kept barking in the background ?


I think this is the guy who brought the dog:  http://amigbg.com/gallery/graak/pages/h_mvc-066f.htm

:-)
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: jeffimix on March 31, 2003, 10:18:11 PM
Hrmm... Yes, the A1 is nothing amazing until it has such a clean, intuitive, and fast OS like AOS4.  Looking at the 'screenshots' of OS4 is enough to make me believe they will release a product. They wouldn't lie about it because they are a small company and its highly illegal to pull people's legs for $$$ .  Yes it isn't finished, but to  me it seems close, like maybe a couple months now close.  sure its  a long wiat, but they can;t put more resources into it. Ainc is a small fish in a pond with things like MS or even Apple or Linux frankly... it has to survive, it can't bother chasing around something it can't eat now, or it'll starve. Out of money, out of luck, out of AOS4 since another Escom'll buy it, or worse, a company that doesn't like it but wants to kill it will buy the company and halt AOS4.  Be patient, I've waited years for the next release of other rgeat things, and usually it just makes them all the better, since its made by the rare peopel who won't release something until it's Right, at least as far as they can tell.
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: anarchic_teapot on March 31, 2003, 10:29:09 PM
Quote
Hooligan_DCS wrote:

one lousy (overpriced) motherboard.


"Overpriced" and "relatively expensive" (because it's still in low-volume production) are two totally different concepts.

You are apparently trying to get people to think that somebody is making an excessive profit out of the sale of A1 mobos.

This is totally untrue.
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Loki1 on March 31, 2003, 11:20:32 PM
Quote

Hooligan_DCS wrote:
Quote
How blind are people not to see that A1 mobo is nothing special and OS4 will be the driving force......


I beg to differ!

As long as A1 is the ONLY non-classic hardware that will be able to run AOS4, it is and will remain SPECIAL!

Loki :-D
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Dan on April 01, 2003, 12:52:50 AM
Delfina Flipper: Yes new amigahardware:-D
Morphos: Well it´s not really AmigaOS just emulation around a microkernel just as Amithlon/Umilator
AROS demo: very intresting cat shaped windows  :-D

Eyetech: "It´s gonna be good  but you can´t run amigaprograms on it yet"  
ZZZZZZZZZZ.....

Heard it before a hundred times
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Hooligan_DCS on April 01, 2003, 04:53:06 AM
Quote

anarchic_teapot wrote:
Quote
"Overpriced" and "relatively expensive" (because it's still in low-volume production) are two totally different concepts.

You are apparently trying to get people to think that somebody is making an excessive profit out of the sale of A1 mobos.

This is totally untrue.


First of all I think it's OVERpriced, not relatively expensive. Second, you think  Eyetech's in this for Pro Bono? I don't think so.
But of course, they are entitled to get profit, how else could they survive? Still it's a very expensive piece of hardware. Very.
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: gary_c on April 01, 2003, 05:49:33 AM
Dan wrote:
Quote
Morphos: Well it´s not really AmigaOS just emulation around a microkernel just as Amithlon/Umilator

And just as AmigaOS4. As for PPC-native software, it'll be up to developers if they want to make versions for both MorphOS and AmigaOS4. Quite a few seem to be interested in both.

- - gary_c

Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Hammer on April 01, 2003, 06:36:59 AM
Quote

AOS on x86 would NOT attract applications, any more than BeOS did!

BeOS doesn't have a common virtual CPU platform between PPC edition and X86 edition.

PS; Bernie does have the official license for AmigaOS from Amiga Inc.  

Quote

Linux runs on PLENTY of x86 boxes - WHERE are ALL THOSE WONDERFUL Linux Games?

One has to consider the people’s mindset who supports Linux.  

Quote
Do you see a pattern here? Other OS' run on x86 - Developers code for Windows!

Name the processor that powers Nintendo Game Cube.
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Hammer on April 01, 2003, 06:49:19 AM
Quote
What new hardware?

Items bought first hand.

Quote

You can play with the nice dongle, thats not industry standard

A dongle is a standard practice in high-end/priced applications in MS Windows world.

Before one can play modern commercial games (e.g. Splinter Cell, Unreal II, UT2003 and 'etc') one will be asked to insert the original CDs. This basically amounts to poor man’s dongle.

Quote
How blind are people not to see that A1 mobo is nothing special

Did this person said anything 'special' in his/her post?

Quote
Sometimes I wonder if some Amiga-people have even touched a computer above the 233mhz barrier, or seen the performance of even a MIDDLE-tech PC these days.
 

Is that relevant to the topic?  
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Hooligan_DCS on April 01, 2003, 07:27:13 AM
Quote
Items bought first hand.


Thats the best you came up with? I have boxed Wizard mouse which is 5-6 years old. When I go back home and open the box, is it new hardware? I didn't thougth so either.

Dongle and copy protection are two different things. Those games have a copy protection (=assuming the player has original cd's in drive), it's not a "poor mans dongle".

Quote

Did this person said anything 'special' in his/her post?


Judging by the spirit and message in posting, yes.

Quote
Sometimes I wonder if some Amiga-people have even touched a computer above the 233mhz barrier, or seen the performance of even a MIDDLE-tech PC these days.

Is that relevant to the topic?  


My personal thoughts in the end. You hate my avatar so much you're going to break my comments to 100 pieces and comment them word by word?




Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Hammer on April 01, 2003, 07:46:10 AM
Quote
Thats the best you came up with?

Is that relevant?  

Quote

I have boxed Wizard mouse which is 5-6 years old. When I go back home and open the box, is it new hardware?

What you are forgetting is the vendor and customer relationship. A product that is second-hand cannot be sold as “new”.

Quote
I didn't thougth so either.

You assume too much.

Quote
Judging by the spirit and message in posting, yes.

Quote it.

Quote
My personal thoughts in the end.

Sure.

Quote

You hate my avatar so much you're going to break my comments to 100 pieces (SNIP)

I have no feelings in regards to your avatar. You assume too much.
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Hooligan_DCS on April 01, 2003, 07:58:36 AM
What a fruitfull conversation. Better end it here.
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Hammer on April 01, 2003, 08:14:39 AM
Quote

Dongle and copy protection are two different things. Those games have a copy protection (=assuming the player has original cd's in drive), it's not a "poor mans dongle".

You missed the main purpose of a dongle.

What is the main purpose of a dongle (e.g. Cubase SX)?
Answer:  Run a single authorised copy at a given session.

What is the purpose of a copy protected CDs (e.g. Suresafe embedded CDs)?
Answer:  Run a single authorised copy at a given session.

*Examples of games that use “full installation” but yet still require the original play disc are;
1. Splinter Cell,
2. Unreal 2
3. UT2003

It’s the right for any software company to protect their software investment. I don’t know why you are making a big fuss in regards to A1's dongle?
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Hooligan_DCS on April 01, 2003, 09:35:44 AM
Quote
It’s the right for any software company to protect their software investment. I don’t know why you are making a big fuss in regards to A1's dongle?


I mentioned dongle on ONE line. Fuss?
I don't know many manufacturers whome have done the same as Eyetech. But, for the sake of continuum... let's look it at this way:
How'd you like if major motherboard manufacturers would include a dongle making it possible to use only Windows as operating system? I am well aware of why it was included, but I am totally against it as the consumer pays the extra price for something as useless as a dongle in AmigaOne.
There is practically NO PIRATES left in Amiga-scene.. only a handful whome like chatting on efnet instead of cracking software.
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: olegil on April 01, 2003, 10:06:17 AM
@Hooligan_DCS:

Quote
How'd you like if major motherboard manufacturers would include a dongle making it possible to use only Windows as operating system? I am well aware of why it was included, but I am totally against it as the consumer pays the extra price for something as useless as a dongle in AmigaOne.


Wow, thanks for pointing out that you haven't even gotten a SINGLE point of what the dongle does. It does NOT ensure that you only run one OS on the machine, it ensures that you only run that version of the OS on THAT machine. Like, you can't buy a computer with Linux and then pirate OS4 later. However, you CAN buy a computer with OS4 and install Linux later. I seriously DO NOT see the problem with this for someone who is NOT contemplating piracy. And THAT'S a FACT (since you're obviously too stupid to understand written language, I'm referring to the fact that I am unable to see how this can be a problem for someone who is not contemplating piracy. That is a fact, because I don't see it.).

Now will you please shut the #### up about things you have NO good arguments for?
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: olegil on April 01, 2003, 10:10:52 AM
Also, how are Genesi any better? Where's the A1 version of MorphOS? Since the Pegasos doesn't have a dongle I should be able to freely download MOS for my AmigaOne, no?

If you could just understand that it's OS4 that has a dongle, NOT the AmigaOne, you might reach some sort of enlightened state.
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Damion on April 01, 2003, 12:21:20 PM
@olegal

>I seriously DO NOT see the problem with this
>for someone who is NOT contemplating piracy

Well olegal, it's been said a million times,
some people do NOT like like the A1 (board),
and would like to BUY OS4 to run on possibly
a Mac/Pegasos...or at least have the door left
open for possibilities other than the A1.
Pulling the 'piracy' card is a cheap shot
(and moreover completely inaccurate and silly).

Protecting the software is a good thing,
but trying to force the ($5-600?) teron
board on people will only make most of them
laugh...and that's not desirable for a new
platform now is it?

BTW: The term "dongle" implies hardware...you
can 'protect' something without using a
specific piece of hardware to go with it.
(and I'm not counting the disc a game comes
on:))
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Hooligan_DCS on April 01, 2003, 12:24:21 PM
All I was giving was an example. Maybe you did not understand that  inside your little head. OS4 for Pegasos, like who in earth was going to do it? Nearly impossible.

And what's this piracy you're talking about? Piracy is almost non-existent on Amiga platform. Do I have to bend it out of a wire? For the price dongles they could have sent out those t-shirts.
I am not against the dongles principle, what it should do. I am against the fact that I will be the one paying for it for no reason what so ever.

Quote
Also, how are Genesi any better? Where's the A1 version of MorphOS? Since the Pegasos doesn't have a dongle I should be able to freely download MOS for my AmigaOne, no?


You will be able to download a free MOS for PowerUp cards anyway. MOS for A1? Well why not.. maybe later.

Special thanks for being so polite.
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Helgis75 on April 01, 2003, 12:24:27 PM
I'm very excited at the moment! I will have my A1G4XE mobo really soon now!!!!! :-)  :-)  :-)  :-D  :-D
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Red_Melons on April 01, 2003, 12:37:59 PM
@Helgis75:

"I'm very excited at the moment! I will have my A1G4XE mobo really soon now!!!!!"

Have you heard anything direct from Eyetech?

_____________________________________

"I am strongly in favour of using poisoned gas against uncivilised tribes"

Winston Churchill during British occupation of Iraq in 1920.
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: JurassicCamper on April 01, 2003, 12:53:32 PM
Quote

Helgis75 wrote:
I'm very excited at the moment! I will have my A1G4XE mobo really soon now!!!!! :-)  :-)  :-)  :-D  :-D


Easy Tiger..... you'll burst a blood vessel.
:-D  :-D
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Helgis75 on April 01, 2003, 01:05:49 PM
As Alan told himself, the boards were stuck in Cologne. Yesterday Alan should have received them from Cologne and Gunne should have them tomorrow. That's 30 of them..7 of them will be delivered directly to Datakompaniet in Norway, despite this being the first shipment of the boards, so i assume you get the picture correctly now..

Hope this info helps.. :-)
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Red_Melons on April 01, 2003, 01:23:58 PM
The boards for AmiBG were stuck in Köln, but what about boards for the UK? Are they on their way from Taiwan or are they already at Eyetech?

_________________________________________

"Preventative war was an invention of Adolf Hitler. I
would not take seriously anyone who suggested such a thing to me."

Dwight Eisenhower
US President in 1953
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Tafka on April 01, 2003, 01:25:55 PM
Yes, I want to know that too.  How many boards are going to be available in the UK?

Surely enough have been produced to satisfy initial demand.
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Hammer on April 01, 2003, 01:58:38 PM
Quote
How'd you like if major motherboard manufacturers would include a dongle making it possible to use only Windows as operating system?

Wrong premise.  Your point of view is flawed since various flavours of Linux and the planned AmigaOS 4.0 will be available for the AmigaOne.  To claim that AmigaOne will only run AmigaOS4.0 is flawed.

Try again.

Btw, most of my clients asked for MS Windows thus your premise is again flawed. I don't why you are using MS Windows as a negative factor when it a strength for selling mainstream PCs.

Obscures companies such as www.locus.com.au is a multi-dollar company due to servicing X86 Windows(and to limited extent X86 Linux) markets.

Quote

I am well aware of why it was included,

How could you know "why it was included" since your premise is wrong?

Quote

but I am totally against it as the consumer pays the extra price for something as useless as a dongle in AmigaOne.

A dongle is useful for limiting their use within authorised scope. Not on some other hardware which doesn’t financially benefit its creator.  

Quote
There is practically NO PIRATES left in Amiga-scene..

Such claims doesn’t hold water when there are illegal copies of Pagestream 4 (cited as an example) going around the Internet. (Such topics are outside the scope of this forum and should be dealt within the proper channels.)  

Software companies has the right (balanced with consumer’s rights)  to take any necessary steps to protect it’s software investments.
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Helgis75 on April 01, 2003, 02:15:32 PM
According to what i have read from the show and to what Alan said, i assume that Eyetech have got the boards. That means Gunne will have his boards tomorrow, and 7 of them will be handed directly to Datakompaniet in Norway.

So i believe that Eyetech just received them...
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Hammer on April 01, 2003, 02:23:18 PM
Quote

Hooligan_DCS wrote:

 For the price dongles they could have sent out those t-shirts.
I

T-shirts is Amiga Inc’s issue not Hyperion or Eyetech.
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: JurassicCamper on April 01, 2003, 02:33:19 PM
Quote

Tafka wrote:
Yes, I want to know that too.  How many boards are going to be available in the UK?

Surely enough have been produced to satisfy initial demand.


None out of the batch Helgis is on about these are just for GGS.
Quote


Alan.. 29th March 2003

....Obviously there was a little delay setting up the testing procedures and
setting up the contracts, so they will take us about a week to get them over
because its too expensive to get them express freighted even if UPS can do
that, and thats why Gunnes boards are in Cologne, because thats where UPS
left them. But that means that we and the manufacturers have a very good
quality assurance procedure, and that means we can pass that on to you.
Overall, we think thats saving time and cost, and thats why you havent seen
them before now. The rest of the boards are being shipped this week, which
I define as starting tomorrow.



Which I interpret as....
Get them W/C 07/04/03 (DD/MM/YY)
But they can go straight out as they have been tested already.

I would assume previous annoucement parameters still apply.
Eg: Pre built systems first / boards in order date order.
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: zudobug on April 01, 2003, 02:41:17 PM
hehe. Does anyone really give a damn about those t-shirts?

I couldn't care less about the t-shirt personally. Maybe the coupong wasn't the wisest purchase ever made by myself and the other people that bought one, but it was a totally idiotic purchase if all we wanted out of it was a stupid t-shirt.

I bought one because I wanted to show my support, because it wasn't much money - maybe I'd been brainwashed by the updates... I don't know. Really don't care. I get to see the CAM and should get money off OS4 if I choose to buy it when it comes out. So what? Whatever!
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: xaccrocheur on April 01, 2003, 02:47:59 PM
Quote

olegil wrote:
(snip)
The firmware (U-Boot) will use serial port for stdin/stdout if you set the environment variables stdin/stdout to serial OR you remove the keyboard/vga card (autodetects...). Thus, you don't need a VGA card or a keyboard for a render-farm.

It has 66MHz PCI if you have a RAID controller or a gigabit ethernet card. Running in a 1U rack box without VGA but with IDE/SCSI RAID or GBE would make for quite a nice server, actually.
(snip)


If i'm understanding correctly, this machine can actually BOOT and operate without any KB and mouse connected to it. You can do that w/ a Mac, but then again good luck for telnet into it and fully operate it.

Very cool indeed. I'm starting to envision sexy LCD touch screens in emmbedded machines...

3 watts. I *love* that number !!!

This roadmap is looking VERY good.

pX
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: xaccrocheur on April 01, 2003, 02:51:47 PM
Quote

zudobug wrote:
hehe. Does anyone really give a damn about those t-shirts?

I couldn't care less about the t-shirt personally. Maybe the coupong wasn't the wisest purchase ever made by myself and the other people that bought one, but it was a totally idiotic purchase if all we wanted out of it was a stupid t-shirt.

I bought one because I wanted to show my support, because it wasn't much money - maybe I'd been brainwashed by the updates... I don't know. Really don't care. I get to see the CAM and should get money off OS4 if I choose to buy it when it comes out. So what? Whatever!


Good attitude, Zud. But mind you, one of the ONLY things that appealed to me about this coupon thing was 1-show support to the guys
2-the Damn T-Shirt !!

So yeah, they are not into fabric and garments, but hey, a promise is a promise. Heck, I'm gonna do this T-Shirt meself, and it's gonna read : I'm one of the 31 Amiga users in France ;)

pX
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Hooligan_DCS on April 01, 2003, 02:57:01 PM
@Hammer

Again, what I was trying to tell is that they are killing a fly with a shotgun, as in taking too big cautions for such little issue as pirated OS4 on something else than AmigaOne.
Let's face it, if someone is David Copperfield-enough to make OS4 work on Pegasos, the same indivual is talented enough to bypass that dongle protection.
But (lets) forget the dongle already, the thread wasn't about it at all.

The excuse of pirates making it too hard to do business  is gone. The lack of userbase is the real reason. What we have mostly left in Amiga community are probably not the most eager ones to pirate everything they get hands on. Trust me, as an ex-pirate group member.
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: olegil on April 01, 2003, 04:07:30 PM
Quote
For the price dongles they could have sent out those t-shirts.


Quite correct.

However, the "dongle" is also called "firmware" so I don't see how anyone could have made any profit from sending out boards without that component. Please tell me?
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: olegil on April 01, 2003, 04:12:27 PM
BUT THE POINT OF THE ####ING DONGLE ISN'T TO ENSURE THAT IT DOESN'T RUN ON THE PEGASOS.

It is to ensure that you (as in Joe Average, not Hooligan_DCS) don't go out and buy a Teron CX/PX and install a pirated copy of AOS4 on that. AOS4 for AmigaOne is sold only in bundles with the hardware, except possibly in bundles with dongles (if there is a market for that).

AOS4 WILL NOT RUN ON A PEGASOS WITHOUT MODIFICATION, so that's not much of a concern (as you correctly identified).
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Darth_X on April 01, 2003, 05:21:20 PM
Quote

 I seriously DO NOT see the problem with this for someone who is NOT contemplating piracy.

Also, how are Genesi any better? Where's the A1 version of MorphOS? Since the Pegasos doesn't have a dongle I should be able to freely download MOS for my AmigaOne, no?



The business model for a Pegasos and MorphOS appears to be based around sales of Pegasos hardware.. the operating system (&  licensed apps) is included in the price of the Pegasos motherboard.

AmigaOS4 is an added cost on top of the price of the AmigaONE motherboard.

As for MorphOS for A1 boards, that's interesting.


olegil, are you a developer?

Quote
However, the "dongle" is also called "firmware" so I don't see how anyone could have made any profit from sending out boards without that component. Please tell me?


The A1 could have used the standard Open Firmware instead of making a custom one? :-D
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse said something again
Post by: Seehund on April 01, 2003, 06:26:30 PM
Hip-shot post in semi-coherent order follows.


@Helgis75

Ask Wayne for a "Helgis ejaculates over some Teron announcement" forum category (and I'll ask for a "Seehund whines over the usual again" category) ;)



@olegil
Quote

The firmware (U-Boot) will use serial port for stdin/stdout if you set the environment variables stdin/stdout to serial OR you remove the keyboard/vga card (autodetects...). Thus, you don't need a VGA card or a keyboard for a render-farm.


Imagine A Beowulf Cluster Of Those! :)

Seriously, you still need at least an OS to run on each box, and there's an onboard NIC, so what would the advantage be over just networking it all "as usual" (not that U-Boot is unique in allowing I/O redirection to other interfaces)? Nobody's ever needed graphics/keyboards at each box for such clustering anyway.



@Odin
Quote

No it's not! The OS these boards were built for still isn't here :-p.


Didn't Linus make his first public release 12 years ago? :) OK, OK, the hardware isn't built for any particular OS, but I couldn't resist... ;)



@Hooligan_DCS
Quote

How blind are people not to see that A1 mobo is nothing special and OS4 will be the driving force. I couldn't care less if it ran on intel and on parts purchable from store next door.


Hear hear!



@vortexau
Quote

During my 30 years of motorcycling, I NEVER bought a really-fast chain-driven machine!


Uh, yeah, but they stopped making good/beautiful cars and motorcycles around 1970, so that's understandable. :)
Comparing that to computers, and using it to excuse poor performance and high cost of supposedly "new" computer hardware is outright ridiculous. For "vintage computing" we've already got e.g. Amigas.

(If someone starts comparing prices and specs of their old Amigas with reasonably modern hardware like a Teron board, then it's time to bring out the LART damnit! Why not go all the way and compare the Terons with the ENIAC? Honestly, some people shouldn't be allowed to buy computers. ;) )

Quote

AOS on x86 would NOT attract applications, any more than BeOS did!


Compared to post-Commodore AmigaOS, BeOS was a veritable honeypot! The demise of BeOS begun before it went x86, but then it was too late it seems. But BeOS lives on.

Quote

Linux runs on PLENTY of x86 boxes - WHERE are ALL THOSE WONDERFUL Linux Games?

Do you see a pattern here? Other OS' run on x86 - Developers code for Windows!


Bad reasoning/example IMO. The few commercial (closed source) Linux games that actually are out there are for... *drumroll*: Linux/x86.

If you make an end-user, "general purpose", "home computing" OS, then you compete with Windows (and other OSes in that broadly defined category) and its apps. No matter what CPU architecture.

Porting apps to another OS is one thing, porting apps to another OS plus another architecture is another. Which do you think is easier? Which do you you think is potentially more commercially interesting, given the vast x86 user/hardware base?

Quote

WHY is MAC OS not on X86? Same reason! Move on!


Because Apple make a living on selling their Macs (not "MACs" BTW, pet peeve of mine). They supposedly have a parallel x86 branch of MacOS, but it'd probably only run on x86 computers built by Apple if it's commercially released.

Anyway, the dice has been rolled for AmigaOS: it became PPC. I'm not all that religious about a specific configuration of silicon logic gates to get involved in that silly x86 vs PPC war all over again. Though I'm not all that extatic over having the PPC path even further narrowed only based on dealerships, trademarks and hardware market control, as you all might have noticed. ;)


@Hammer:
Quote

You missed the main purpose of a dongle.

What is the main purpose of a dongle (e.g. Cubase SX)?
Answer: Run a single authorised copy at a given session.


Yeah, normally. But what is the main purpose of dongled motherboard firmware together with compulsory OS/HW bundling and hardware dealer licensing?
Answer: To invent a restricted "Amiga hardware market" out of a subset of an ordinary third party hardware market.

Dongling does not prevent piracy. Personally I don't object to dongling as a concept, it's the implementation in this specific case that is just sick and counterproductive.

To paraphrase South Park / Slashdot:

1. Try to "prevent piracy" by not selling the software.
2. ???
3. Profit!!!

This method does not protect the software any better or worse than your Cubase example. It only protects the marketshare of a distributor of third party hardware, which should be irrelevant to AmigaOS.

But hey, there's always the absolutely humongous and incredibly lucrative market of people who wet themselves as soon as they see the "AmigaOne" trademark. THAT will surely ensure a prosperous future for AmigaOS! :)



@olegil:
Quote

I saw someone making criticism about external Q&A and excuses and stuff. The big thing about external Q&A isn't that it's external, it's that it is in the same country as the production plant.


What I find funny is that Eyetech originally said that they would QA test the Terons themselves. :D
Unpack Terons... Peel off QA stickers... Look for the "On" button... Shake boards to hear if anything rattles... Slap on "AmigaOne by Eyetech" and new QA stickers... Pack "AmigaOnes"... Ship to dealers or send back to Taiwan...

Let's hope that this external company has at least the impressive engineering expertise and advanced testing equipment that Eyetech apparently must have, and that they too have passed the strict Amiga, Inc. certifications. :D

What a bloody sad and overcomplicated circus all this has been made to be.
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Seehund on April 01, 2003, 06:32:50 PM
Quote

olegil wrote:

However, the "dongle" is also called "firmware" ...


Nope. Terons sold normally will, according to Hyperion, have the same firmware as the ones sold to AmigaOS users. The "dongle" has no technically functional or operational purpose, regardless of whether it happens to be stored in the same physical *PROM chip that also holds the firmware. Think of it as an embedded serial number. A dongle, short and simple.
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Helgis75 on April 01, 2003, 06:45:15 PM
Just recently got another mail from Datakompaniet after asking them if i am one of the lucky 7 to get one of the first boards, an A1G4XE. They said YES, because i already ordered for an A1XE just before Christmas 2002, and rechanged the order to the top-of-the-line AmigaOne G4-XE early January 2003, so yes, i am one of the 7!!!!! :-)  :-)  :-D  :-D  :-D  :-D  :-D  :-D
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: on April 01, 2003, 06:49:43 PM
Helgis,

You have no idea how much I hope that you do get one of these A1 boards.  Whatever the reason, whatever the cost, and whether it's worth a damn or not, you should be the first to get one.

Here's hoping that you do.

RLFrost
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: olegil on April 01, 2003, 07:09:21 PM
Quote

Darth_X wrote:
Quote

 I seriously DO NOT see the problem with this for someone who is NOT contemplating piracy.

Also, how are Genesi any better? Where's the A1 version of MorphOS? Since the Pegasos doesn't have a dongle I should be able to freely download MOS for my AmigaOne, no?



The business model for a Pegasos and MorphOS appears to be based around sales of Pegasos hardware.. the operating system (&  licensed apps) is included in the price of the Pegasos motherboard.

AmigaOS4 is an added cost on top of the price of the AmigaONE motherboard.

As for MorphOS for A1 boards, that's interesting.


olegil, are you a developer?



Well, I'm a Linux developer. Some of the other Linux developers are currently busy writing OS4 drivers, but I have devoted myself to making 2.5.65 run on the AmigaOne instead. At the moment I am actually more interested in Linux than OS4. But only because I now have both an A500 and an A1200 in working condition again. For the first time since ages :-)

Quote


Quote
However, the "dongle" is also called "firmware" so I don't see how anyone could have made any profit from sending out boards without that component. Please tell me?


The A1 could have used the standard Open Firmware instead of making a custom one? :-D


There would still have been the need to include the frelling "dongle" chip, now wouldn't it? And the frelling Open Firmware didn't excactly WORK either.
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: olegil on April 01, 2003, 07:11:52 PM
 
Quote

Seehund wrote:
Quote

olegil wrote:

However, the "dongle" is also called "firmware" ...


Nope. Terons sold normally will, according to Hyperion, have the same firmware as the ones sold to AmigaOS users. The "dongle" has no technically functional or operational purpose, regardless of whether it happens to be stored in the same physical *PROM chip that also holds the firmware. Think of it as an embedded serial number. A dongle, short and simple.


Oh, so now a serial number suddenly costs MONEY to implement?

I was answering Hoolingan_DCS, PLEASE try to include some CONTEXT next time.

If there's supposed to be ANY saving of money from NOT including the dongle, it would HAVE to be by shipping without the chip. Seriously.
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Hooligan_DCS on April 01, 2003, 07:16:46 PM
The good old saying "Time is money" is more to the point than never before.
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Paul_Gadd on April 01, 2003, 07:16:48 PM
Just wait to see if you get the boards instead of believing every little thing these Amiga companies say.
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: dammy on April 01, 2003, 07:17:52 PM
Quote
by Hattig on 2003/3/31 14:56:54

Quote:
Hate to break it to you, but Apple has maintained OSX on x86 for years. Gee, wonder why Apple is spending R&D cash on maintaining a x86 port?


To ensure a clean code base, and nothing more. It only has drivers for one 4 year old Intel chipset, 440BX.

Apple will never move to any variant of x86, or x86-64.


I wouldn't bet the farm on that statement.  Apple knows it's life blood is tied to the CPU, and the once mighty AIM alliance is now quiet dead.  That means Apple has to depend on hand outs from IBM.   If IBM decides it's not worth developing any futher/faster the 970, Apple is in dead in the water.  

Which would you rather steer Apple towards?  IBM's side project (this is a joke compared to their total revenue stream) or AMD products when AMD stock is at a low point and Apple's coffers are pretty well filled?  IMO, I would rather go the latter, and have the CPU producer by the balls.  No, this would not mean OSX would run on generic hardware, it still could easily be tied into Apple chipsets.

Dammy
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Hammer on April 01, 2003, 11:32:47 PM
Quote
Again, what I was trying to tell is that they are killing a fly with a shotgun, as in taking too big cautions for such little issue as pirated OS4 on something else than AmigaOne.

Such statement is subject to subjective point of view.  

Quote

Let's face it, if someone is David Copperfield-enough to make OS4 work on Pegasos, the same indivual is talented enough to bypass that dongle protection.

Let's face it, 'cracking' doesn’t stop software companies to include such protection. IF you don’t like the final cost then don’t buy the product.

Quote

The excuse of pirates making it too hard to do business is gone. The lack of userbase is the real reason.

That’s one leap of logic in regards to "lack of userbase" and issue of software protection.
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Hammer on April 01, 2003, 11:35:02 PM
Quote
when AMD stock is at a low point and Apple's coffers are pretty well filled? IMO

The number of shares will be another factor btw...
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: takemehomegrandma on April 01, 2003, 11:43:07 PM
Quote

rlfrost wrote:
Helgis,

You have no idea how much I hope that you do get one of these A1 boards.  Whatever the reason, whatever the cost, and whether it's worth a damn or not, you should be the first to get one.

Here's hoping that you do.

RLFrost


I second to that. If there is any fairness in this world, then Helgis would get the very first A1 from the production run. And I mean that! :-)
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Dan on April 01, 2003, 11:54:35 PM
Quote
Quote
Morphos: Well it´s not really AmigaOS just emulation around a microkernel just as Amithlon/Umilator

And just as AmigaOS4. As for PPC-native software, it'll be up to developers if they want to make versions for both MorphOS and AmigaOS4. Quite a few seem to be interested in both.

No, AmigaOS4 is built from the original source code but cleaned up and improved beyond recognition!  :-D
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Dan on April 01, 2003, 11:54:58 PM
The DONGLE as you like to call it:
The bad thing is that this only benefits Eyetech not the users or Hyperion.
It´s not a dongle it´s firmware (BIOS/kickstart whatever).
Imagine an A500 without ROM,wouldn´t be  very useful.  :-)
That said other motherboard manufacturers should have a way of including the dongle thing( i´m thinking elbox shark), competiton is good. I don´t want eyetech to become the next Micro$oft.
I don´t want AmigaOS locked in with Eyetech/Teron, i want to be able to run it on anything thats possible PPC, x86,  StrongArm, anything.
But i understand that Hyperion need copyprotection so that they can atleast cover the development cost, look what happened the last time amiga had a big market.
Sadly I still belive more in AROS than in AmigaOS, and don´t get me started about AmigaOS 5.0 DE .....
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: gary_c on April 02, 2003, 02:41:02 AM
Dan wrote:
Quote
No, AmigaOS4 is built from the original source code but cleaned up and improved beyond recognition!  
I'm not sure building from the original source code is really better than doing a modern functional equivalent from a fresh start, even when the original source code is intact. But it's too arcane to debate. Labors of love such as AmigaOS4 and MorphOS deserve to succeed; let's hope they both find a niche. :-)

-- gary_c
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse said something again
Post by: xaccrocheur on April 02, 2003, 03:25:09 AM
Quote

Seehund wrote:


The longest post in A.org history. I totally agree with you about the nonsense of creating a niche HW market. Sounds like a CBM idea from the good ol' years ;)

Quote
Have you helped saving  AmigaOS and a free PPC hardware market today?


Yes I have 8-)

pX
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Siggy on April 02, 2003, 07:26:17 AM
Quote
Linux runs on PLENTY of x86 boxes - WHERE are ALL THOSE WONDERFUL Linux Games?


Well seeing that Linux was never intended as a games platform -- and as has never really advertised itself as such...
Generally people are running linux as a unix replacement, or for server apps, still others just like hacking around on an OS where you have the source code to examine.

Still, you can find plenty of open source efforts at The Linux Game Tome (http://www.happypenguin.org), updates on games usually on Linux Games (http://www.linuxgames.com), oh and I remember seeing a couple being released on this site (http://www.hyperion-entertainment.com/_linux/index.html) a while ago.....

Quote
Do you see a pattern here? Other OS' run on x86 - Developers code for Windows!


This must be why linux has no developers.... everything just lept fully formed from the forehead of Linus Torvalds, a-la Zeus.

There is a plethora of apps out there - which ipso-facto states there are a plethora of developers out there.  

Still, people in glass houses --- You ask me where my wonderful games are, I'll ask where is your wonderful OS...

Siggy.




Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Hammer on April 02, 2003, 08:07:57 AM
Quote

Dan wrote:
The DONGLE as you like to call it:
The bad thing is that this only benefits Eyetech not the users or Hyperion.

Did Hyperion said anything negative regarding the use of 'dongle'?

Quote

That said other motherboard manufacturers should have a way of including the dongle thing( i´m thinking elbox shark), competiton is good. I don´t want eyetech to become the next Micro$oft.

Eyetech is hardly Microsoft i.e. I recall Eyetech doesn't create the OS.  

Quote

I don´t want AmigaOS locked in with Eyetech/Teron, i want to be able to run it on anything thats possible PPC, x86,  StrongArm, anything.

Only IF more vendors will come and obtain the license to get the AmigaOS 4.0 for their motherboards then there would be other alternatives.

The licensing model that AmigaOS group seems to be employing is the PalmOS model. Note that Microsoft has entirely different model compared to PalmOS or AmigaOS 4.x.

Quote

Sadly I still belive more in AROS than in AmigaOS,

AROS is nice, but it doesn't run any legacy AmigaOS applications (without the use of UAE).
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Helgis75 on April 02, 2003, 10:13:00 AM
I certainly look forward to a very exciting time with my A1G4XE when i get it soon! :-) It gonna be a great pleasure! I miss the AmigaOS, so i definitely look forward to use the new AmigaOS 4!!!  :-)

Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Atheist on April 02, 2003, 10:44:44 AM
As long as the "dongle" doesn't leave a finger print, i.e. unique serial no. in each machine, I have no problem with it. I wonder if there's a loss of performance, even .5% is too much.

For the people that seem to want to just get a copy of AOS4.0 and buy an imuc, well, there are several million of those (imucs) out there, and I doubt many of those users would PAY for the OS.


Let's look at the numbers.

500 UKP = $542 dollars for the board * approx. 1000 immediate orderers = $542,000.

Egg on MY face!

500 UKP = $783.39 US dollars for the board * approx. 1000 immediate orderers = $783,390.

Apologies, all round. Thanks MiniBobF.
 


BUT, they purchased Amiga IP rights from Gateway 2000, in Dec. 1999 for at LEAST $5,000,000.

WHERE IS THE PROFIT???? It's 3 1/2 years later, how are we being gouged??? SOMEONE needs to pony up their investment cost. And there aren't 250,000 of us out here to split the cost up/lower cost of production. The only chance is to make some units, that they can shop around to the BIG players, to show what all of the HOOPLA was about.

It will cost the few of us dearly out of pocket, but everything of value has SOME martyrs!!

Besides, as I've said before, participate and feel special, WHO THE HELL ELSE WOULD DO THIS FOR FANATICS LIKE US????

AmigaOne! Passion, eloquence, freedom, personality!
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Siggy on April 02, 2003, 11:15:45 AM
@Helgis

You know, I really hope you get your board soon.
I hope that OS4 is hot on it's tail and you don't have to wait too long
to play with it.
I hope that it's fast, responsive, and that it brings with it the simple fun
that I recall from playing with all the Ami's that I've owned over the years.

Most of all I hope that it ends the squabbling and general b@tchiness that
abounds at the moment.

If it's released, and it lives up to expectations - if it's what I would expect of
an Amiga... or if it looks like it has the potential to join the equipment that is now
my lifesblood, I'll write out a cheque for an entire system.

If not, I'll let what classic equipment I have serve out it's last days in service,
file the Amiga under the 'good ole days' of my computing hobby and move on.

It'll be kept in good company with computers that date back to the mid 70's.
But I'm too old for optimism, and have too many responsibilities to spend that kind of
money on faith alone.

I'll make my judgments when I see the product.

Siggy.
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: JurassicCamper on April 02, 2003, 11:20:39 AM
Quote

gary_c wrote:
I'm not sure building from the original source code is really better than doing a modern functional equivalent from a fresh start


Thats what hyperion have done with EXECSG.  :roll:

As for the dongle I would imagine that during the installation a function / functions will be called that are in the ROM.

Or if the boot device is set to CD-ROM then it will check for specific files on the CD before installing it.  

This way the system  knows you have a Amiga OS CD in the drive and will stop it from booting from the CD-ROM.

So what about a cloned HD with OS4 already installed.

Well I image that the HAL or EXEC during initialisation will call functions in the ROM that need to be present for the OS to Boot.

This is the way I would do it rather than checking a memory location in the ROM for a value as that could be easily cracked as the comparision value needed would have to be in the HAL / EXEC code its self.

Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Helgis75 on April 02, 2003, 11:22:31 AM
Thank to you who so kindly are cheering me up and so positive to the news of the AmigaOne! Thank you!

I do have a lot of ideas about what to do when i get my motherboard. I do have a lot of plans! I want to be able to feed ideas of new 3D-games for the AmigaOne-platform to the big software houses! I want to make wonderful music and a lot more!

Keep the feedback coming! It could get over 100 replies here! This is undoubly the most popular topics these times!  :-)  :-)  :-)  :-)  :-)  :-)  :-D  :-D  :-D

This topic truly ROCKS!!!!!!!! :-)  :-)  :-)  :-D  :-D  :-D  :-D
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Helgis75 on April 02, 2003, 11:25:05 AM
This is reply number 100! Wow! Keep the replies coming! Let push the topic to new heighs!!!! :-)
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: z5 on April 02, 2003, 11:33:49 AM
well, i for one can't understand why somebody is so excited about a linux box, unless he is seriously interested in linux ofcourse  ;-)  But then everybody is entitled top their opinion ofcourse.

I've got the impression that Helgis expects his OS4 in a week or two but that will not be the case. So until OS4 is released, it is a linux box, probably interesting to developers and linux users.

I for one am not one bit excited about the AOne. I will buy it because i want OS4 but that's it. Ofcourse, i am really happy that it will finally support industry standard hardware, meaning that i will be able to go into my local computer store and buy hardware cheap.

And the idea that i will get a decent graphics card is also nice, as well as i soundcard.

But excited about AOne? naah, OS4 is the thing to look out for. Amiga used to be about the combination of the OS and the custom hardware. Now, it will be the OS only that makes it an Amiga.
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Helgis75 on April 02, 2003, 11:42:55 AM
I agree with someone in the point that AmigaOne is nothing special without OS4. With OS4, the users will feel very much at home. No, i don't expect the OS4 to be out that soon. I guess Mai or June, after having read Alans' speech very carefully. But running Linux isn't that bad either. Think about all the amazing games on the Mac-side, and you can run MOL (Mac On Linux)! Yes, that's right! That what you can do! For the moment, Linux will do just fine..

The point for AmigaOne to be an alternative to the Linux-platform is to be the cheapest and the most flexible choice of hardware other than the traditional x86 and Windows-territory..I think most people are more or less tired with the Windows-systems anyway, so such a new PPC-platform like AmigaOne is truly a BREEZE!!!
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Atheist on April 02, 2003, 11:55:54 AM
@ z5

I love the integrated SW/HW combo that Amiga is, but they couldn't afford to make a multi-register 256 bit blitter, 256 bit custom Zorro IV bus, SMP, 64 bit CPU, and all the other "goodies" that Amiga could be, ... we have to wait for them to rake in their first billion!!!  :-D   :-D   :-D

BUT, can't Helgis75 at least use Linux UAE?? It does exist, doesn't it?

AmigaOne! Chicken and the egg, so the A1G4XE is ....?
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: JurassicCamper on April 02, 2003, 12:16:47 PM
Quote

Helgis75 wrote:
I agree with someone in the point that AmigaOne is nothing special without OS4. With OS4, the users will feel very much at home. No, i don't expect the OS4 to be out that soon. I guess Mai or June, after having read Alans' speech very carefully.


[speculation]
It maybe sooner, at least internally anyway.

Rogue commented the other day that's its almost done.

Alan also said he is back in China in 2 weeks for another conference seminar.

He put up this ppc forum slide and look at the last bullet point.

They want to show the benifits of PPC. I dont think he'll be taking his CD32 along to do that.
[/speculation]

(http://paula.tidstrand.com/amigbg_slides/10.jpg)
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Helgis75 on April 02, 2003, 01:44:59 PM
I hope that this topic also could help new people to get attracted to the AmigaOne/AmigaOS4-platform. I really promise you it will be a very exciting experience, and well worth it! Come on! Pop in here, check the latest news hinted here and write in you comments, thoughts and feelings of the AmigaOne! This topic is so interesting that i don't think it will end for quite some time!  :-)  :-D

Come on, don't be shy! Pop in and join the rest of us!
We promise, you won't regret it!  :-)  :-)  :-)  :-)  :-)  :-)
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Atheist on April 02, 2003, 02:12:56 PM
Hello Helgis75,

Why did you post this under Emulation? Probably should have been in the HW forum?

AmigaOne! AmigaAnyEveryWare!!!  :-D  :-D  :-D
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Helgis75 on April 02, 2003, 02:16:59 PM
I didn't notice this is the Emulation-side, but anyway, never mind. This topic is still the most popular one! Everybody knows what i mean about this topic!

Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Dan on April 02, 2003, 02:51:49 PM
Quote
Quote

Dan wrote:
The DONGLE as you like to call it:
The bad thing is that this only benefits Eyetech not the users or Hyperion.


Did Hyperion said anything negative regarding the use of 'dongle'?

No, but at the moment it limits the number of users/OSlicenses


Quote
Quote

That said other motherboard manufacturers should have a way of including the dongle thing( i´m thinking elbox shark), competiton is good. I don´t want eyetech to become the next Micro$oft.


Eyetech is hardly Microsoft i.e. I recall Eyetech doesn't create the OS.


More like Apple and the evil Steve Jobs then, killing the clones ( MacOS licensing companys like Daystar, Motorola, Power Computing) and pushing all innovative ideas into the ground.
And he launched the Cubes, i tell you he is an evil borg leader


Quote

AROS is nice, but it doesn't run any legacy AmigaOS applications (without the use of UAE).


?????!!!!  :-?
Oh yes it does, on 68k machines.
AmigaOS 4.0 don´t run 68k code on a PPC without the 68k JIT that is technical impossible.
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Dan on April 02, 2003, 02:55:08 PM
Quote
[speculation]
It maybe sooner, at least internally anyway.

Yes a demobetaversions was meant to be on AmiGBG
In a couple of days they will actually have something to show off.
 :-D
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: MiniBobF on April 02, 2003, 03:53:29 PM
@Atheist

Quote
500 UKP = $542 dollars


Er, no.

500UKP = approx USD950
USD542 =  approx £290
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: z5 on April 02, 2003, 04:06:26 PM
Quote
Rogue commented the other day that's its almost done


Not true. They have OS4 booting and working on Cyberstorm. No news has been said about OS4 on AOne. There is a big difference.
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Kronos on April 02, 2003, 04:21:16 PM
Quote


BUT, they purchased Amiga IP rights from Gateway 2000, in Dec. 1999 for at LEAST $5,000,000.

WHERE IS THE PROFIT???? It's 3 1/2 years later, how are we being gouged??? SOMEONE needs to pony up their investment cost. And there aren't 250,000 of us out here to split the cost
......



a) Noone really knows how much money was really paid as it was
pretty much an insider deal.

Gauging the sum would benefit Amino (AInc) as it made them look
bigger then they were, and GateWay as it was easier to apiece
the shareholders of the loss made with Amiga-adventure.

Looking back at what prices were paid by Escom and later GateWay
when there still was a real market, I would say 5m $ is/was way
out of line.

b) Even if it is true, so what ?
They paid for IP the didn't want to know, just to get an obscure
brand-name and the chance to lure developers to a completly
unrelated platform (Intent). Only when they found out that this
didn't work they decided to go back to the real AOS.

Two f***-ups and 2 scams later they gave it to Hyperion.

So why should they have any rights on us users ?

Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Zorro on April 02, 2003, 04:31:06 PM
Dan wrote:

Quote
In a couple of days they will actually have something to show off.


This is only true for CS edition... but is wonderful anyway.

For the AOne version it will take (a lot ?) more time.  :-(
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Wilse on April 02, 2003, 04:50:50 PM
Quote

takemehomegrandma wrote:
Quote

rlfrost wrote:
Helgis,

You have no idea how much I hope that you do get one of these A1 boards.  Whatever the reason, whatever the cost, and whether it's worth a damn or not, you should be the first to get one.

Here's hoping that you do.

RLFrost


I second to that. If there is any fairness in this world, then Helgis would get the very first A1 from the production run. And I mean that! :-)


Amen to that!

Have any of you in the UK seen the Hula-Hoops ads. with the reluctant star? Ainc should recruit Helgis to star in TV ads. for the A1, except he wouldn't be looking bewildered, rather bursting with enthusiasm!  :-D

Go Helgis!  :-P
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Atheist on April 02, 2003, 10:01:07 PM
Quote

MiniBobF wrote:
@Atheist

Quote
500 UKP = $542 dollars


Er, no.

500UKP = approx USD950
USD542 =  approx £290


Thanks MiniBobF.
I used Euro to $USD, by mistake. :-(
Fixed my post on page 5.

I got 500 UKP = $783.39 USD on
www.XE.Com

AmigaOne! Check, and double check your facts!
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Atheist on April 02, 2003, 10:38:35 PM
Quote

Kronos wrote:

Looking back at what prices were paid by Escom and later GateWay
when there still was a real market, I would say 5m $ is/was way
out of line.


I agree, but I know you know, on at least 1 of the transfers of ownership from Commodore to Escom, or Escom to Gateway, the bankruptcy judge said, the offer was too low, and raised the price.


Quote

Kronos wrote:

b) Even if it is true, so what ?
They paid for IP the didn't want to know, just to get an obscure
brand-name and the chance to lure developers to a completly
unrelated platform (Intent). Only when they found out that this
didn't work they decided to go back to the real AOS.

Two f***-ups and 2 scams later they gave it to Hyperion.

So why should they have any rights on us users ?



I agree that AOS should have been pursued, right from day one. I was not happy with the intent/elate/Linux/Qnix... stuff either.

AOS is an OS, and should have been coded, right away.

As for f***-U.P.S. and scams, and rights on us users, everybody makes mistakes, but, I wouldn't say scams. THEY WILL NOT GET ANYWHERE IF THEY SCAM.

So, NO, I do not agree with this, at all!

...rights on us users.

They will, "very soon now" (Tm), have a product, for us "users", who will decide if it meets our needs, and will purchase it on that basis.

WE have the "rights" on whether we think it's what we expect/need and then the "rights" TO buy, or NOT to buy.

They play a part, and we play our part! We could walk away at any time, but that would almost be a breach of trust, because WE HARASSED THEM FOR YEARS, to do this for us.

Let's not let a few dollars stand in the way of our dreams.

AmigaOne! It's THAT good!
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Hammer on April 02, 2003, 11:54:12 PM
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More like Apple and the evil Steve Jobs then,
killing the clones ( MacOS licensing companys like Daystar, Motorola, Power Computing) and pushing all innovative ideas into the ground.

Did Amiga Inc issue an edict to limit hardware vendors to One like Steve Job's edict?  

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Oh yes it does, on 68k machines.


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AROS/m68k-pp

Flavour: Native
Status: Partly working (in an emulator), incomplete driver support
Maintained: Yes

AROS/m68k-pp is the native port of AROS to the Palm line of handheld computers and compatibles ("pp" stands for "palm pilot", which was the name of the first handhelds of this line). This means that you might be able to take AROS with you in your pocket when travelling in the future...

This port is currently very raw. It does mostly work (running in an emulator, since nobody wants to risk trashing their expensive hardware just yet) but there is still a lot of work left. There is a graphics driver, but not any input ones. This port is not available for download at this time.
...

How does one claim AROS works with legacy AmigaOS applications when this port is not available for public download?

Secondly, my post is in the context of the main X86 AROS edition. 68k AROS port  is pretty pointless when there is a 68K/AmigaClassic version of AmigaOS.

Thirdly, AROS's goals/focus is somewhat different to AmigaOS 4.0  i.e. running AmigaOS legacy applications on non-68k based hardware while moving forward to native applications.

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AmigaOS 4.0 don´t run 68k code on a PPC without the 68k JIT that is technical impossible.

I don't recall the planned release version of A1/AmigaOS 4.0 is separated from its 68k component.
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Dan on April 03, 2003, 12:41:57 AM
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BUT, they purchased Amiga IP rights from Gateway 2000, in Dec. 1999 for at LEAST $5,000,000.

Eyetech didn´t, Amiga DE Inc did and they can go play with their DE on Win CE and make the money off the CEgeeks.
I don´t want to give them any money for making DE crap  and making the Amiga name look bad.
How is the Amiganame license written does DE inc get a precentage of the price of every sold machine or was it a onetime payment?
Hyperion making profit of me is cool with me, Eyetech doing the same is not a bad thing but DE Inc i hate!
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Hammer on April 03, 2003, 12:51:00 AM
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No, but at the moment it limits the number of users/OSlicenses

IF we flip the scenario around in the POV of the OS’s creators; the protection itself is not the problem i.e. it’s the lack of vendors who are interested with AmigaOS 4.0.   Without a demonstrable OS product, this situation wouldn’t get better.
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Hammer on April 03, 2003, 01:35:48 AM
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I think most people are more or less tired with the Windows-systems anyway

Have you done a valid statistical test on that?

How could you say "I think most people are more or less tired with the Windows-systems anyway" when people buys X86/Windows to run their software investments (while having the security of future product path)?

Secondly, since there is plenty of X86/Windows base IT companies I don’t think they wouldn’t abandon their “bread and butter” cash cow.

Just think about it in regards to the economic terms.
Title: Re: Alan Redhouse revealed the impressive future of AmigaOne!!!!! (from AmiGBG 2003)
Post by: Kronos on April 03, 2003, 04:30:29 AM
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As for f***-U.P.S. and scams, and rights on us users, everybody makes mistakes, but, I wouldn't say scams. THEY WILL NOT GET ANYWHERE IF THEY SCAM.



They have taken money for someoneelses products twice, knowing
that those products didn't exist in a soon to release state,
but still people are defending them.

They haven't even been able to deliever a few $ of pre-payed
cotton after 2/3 of a year, not even a REAL reason why they
didn't deliever,
but still are defending them.

I would say they allready have gotten away with it.