Timberwolf Progress Update

[Fab]

What i can't get is why a talented coder like yourself, needs to bash someone else effort.

And where do you see bashing? I only said what kind of work it represented in both projects.

[Crumb]

ear, ear! porting OWB was a huge task while porting FF was/is trivial?

That depends on the quality of the port. If you add a few ifdefs and type "make" and you get an alien thingie that doesn't use Amiga UI, doesn't use Amiga libraries, doesn't use Amiga locale, is slow etcetera... you'll get a poor port.

Examples of poorly done ports:
OS4 OWB ports (specially the first ones that relied on SDL)
Firefox for OS4

Examples of excellent ports:
Netsurf for OS4
Odissey for MorphOS

ATM Odissey runs rings around all existing Amiga browsers so you can safely say that porting it took much more work than porting Firefox.

BTW coder skills also affect the quality of the port and Fab is a great coder and his products are great too (MPlayer, Odissey...). His two most famous ports are probably the best ports done to any platform.

[Framiga]

Crumb, nobody is arguing about Fab skills (everybody knows that).

and it is for this exact fact thats he doesn't need to repeat it ad nauseam.

We already know.

[takemehomegrandma]

That depends on the quality of the port. If you add a few ifdefs and type "make" and you get an alien thingie that doesn't use Amiga UI, doesn't use Amiga libraries, doesn't use Amiga locale, is slow etcetera... you'll get a poor port.

Examples of poorly done ports:
OS4 OWB ports (specially the first ones that relied on SDL)
Firefox for OS4

Examples of excellent ports:
Netsurf for OS4
Odissey for MorphOS

ATM Odissey runs rings around all existing Amiga browsers so you can safely say that porting it took much more work than porting Firefox.

BTW coder skills also affect the quality of the port and Fab is a great coder and his products are great too (MPlayer, Odissey...). His two most famous ports are probably the best ports done to any platform.

I agree, and what some people seems to miss when they are comparing it to others, is that Odyssey isn't "just a port", it's a lot of *development* on top of that as well. That's why it's so good and unique, and simply can't be compared to other "OWB" or such. They aren't even in the same league. Odyssey is the only, real, full-fledged *Amiga browser*, the only of its kind...

[itix]

@the bickerers...

For pity's sake, listen to yourselves.

There was a time when having more than one application for a given task was seen as a good thing. For years we had no modern standards compliant browsers and it sucked. Now we have several based WebKit (OWB/Oddysey) and soon gecko Firefox/Timberwolf). There's also NetSurf.

This is a good thing (tm).

I think the original fight was about Timberwolf not being open source what is irrelevant (to many ?) because there are other browsers already for other Amiga platforms... There is not much interest to start other Firefox porting projects. Maybe in the future if someone finds interest.

Personally I am missing Java because crappy and poor Danish bank sites coded by retards cant work without it :-P

[drHirudo]

I think the original fight was about Timberwolf not being open source what is irrelevant (to many ?) because there are other browsers already for other Amiga platforms... There is not much interest to start other Firefox porting projects. Maybe in the future if someone finds interest.

Personally I am missing Java because crappy and poor Danish bank sites coded by retards cant work without it :-P

Well, I did not read such thread in a long time and I see people are still fighting over which Amigoid OS have better browser, while all the Amiga incarcinations lack serious applications and cool games to make the Amigas useful and fun in the current environment.

[Minuous]

>Odyssey is the only, real, full-fledged *Amiga browser*, the only of its kind...

You're forgetting AWeb there...

[takemehomegrandma]

>Odyssey is the only, real, full-fledged *Amiga browser*, the only of its kind...

You're forgetting AWeb there...

Yeah Aweb, hehe...

[hooligan]

Regarding your point about the Amiga being commercially dead, I guess that really depends on what you mean.

Amiga has been dead commercially for a decade now. It has nothing to do with anyone meaning anything, its just a cold hard fact. Having a Firefox-port does not revive Amiga either, nothing will. Its more of a nice commodity than a part of marketing plan, something for the hobbyists. Certainly not the most important thing atm, not even close.

[magnetic]

Hooligan

You are completely wrong in what you are saying. FF 4 port could attract new users. How this can be denied is beyond me.. obviously nothing "commercial" will come from the platform.. (and by "commercial" i think you mean "industrial" )

[dreamcast270mhz]

:rolleyes:

A firefox port is a good thing, not a bad one. As amiga users we have to pick and choose your battles. You don't like it? Fine, there are other options but your negative and snide comments fall on deaf ears of the developers.

[Duce]

Having a modern browser for PPC/OS4 will nto bring "Amiga" back from the dead by any means.

Days are long gone, sorry - and yeah, I was one of the first in line to buy a SAM.  I enjoy it greatly - for what it does.  For what it lacks, the price is still hard to swallow.  That being said, I still use it daily and love the little thing.

A modern browser would make these systems a little more daily driver.

Know what I did this morning?  Checked on the BBS, running on the SAM.  All fine.  Thought I would check my email and feeds while still on the SAM, realized once again the current browser offerings absolutely puke the minute they hit anything heavy with "Web 2.0" content.  You can no more do "common" internet things on it than you can a 4 year old deep fryer, lol.  If you want something to use for daily usage atm, go MorphOS.

Grabbed my iphone - back in business.

Yes, OS4 NEEDS DESPERATELY a modern browser, but it's not going to bring us back to the glory days.

[dreamcast270mhz]

@Duce

Not trying to say that. Not even making MorphOS, OS 4 and classic x86 will. We need to take small steps and present a viable alternative. I know 3 people who would buy an X1000, if OS4 had more modern features. I demoed a SAM440ep, interesting but underwhelming compared to the A1. If the X1k drops in price from interest and buying then I will buy one, if it ever hits >1200. I think having a modern browser will help us, and I think people that do not use OS4 or have not demoed it should keep their mouths shut, MOS already has a great browser but I'm gunning for both camps.

[takemehomegrandma]

A firefox port is a good thing, not a bad one.

Nobody has said it's a bad thing for OS4 to have more browsers. On that platform, the Internet situation is desperate...

[takemehomegrandma]

Hooligan

You are completely wrong in what you are saying. FF 4 port could attract new users. How this can be denied is beyond me.. obviously nothing "commercial" will come from the platform.. (and by "commercial" i think you mean "industrial" )

Oh, but it's commercially dead allright, and some tens or hundreds new users ("inbred" from other parts of "the Amiga market" (cough cough - did that guy just say "market") that is equally commercially dead) won't change that fact. The fact that someone charge money for something doesn't make it commercially viable, in Amiga-land it just means that someone will hopefully cover their costs and have money for an occasional pizza with a few beers. Everything today is relying on volunteer work after the daytime work is over from people seeing this as their hobby. Nothing wrong in this though, we should be glad as long as people like Fab (and many others) continue to invest their free time into the platform!

[jorkany]

Hooligan

You are completely wrong in what you are saying. FF 4 port could attract new users. How this can be denied is beyond me.. obviously nothing "commercial" will come from the platform.. (and by "commercial" i think you mean "industrial" )

Why would a port of FF attract new users? You can run FF for free on a number of platforms already, on hardware that is readily available for well under the $$$ you would sink into an OS4 system. You don't even have to get into the fact that Timberwolf is not going to be keeping up with FF, and maybe is not even going to be maintained much at all - the alpha has been around since what, 2009 and the Friedens just recently decided to ****can it and start over. Why would such a version of FF be attractive to anyone? Because it's fun to struggle with things that don't quite work right, take forever to get fixed, and new features available on every other platform don't get incorporated?

Get a grip, man.