Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Author Topic: What would you want the next Amiga to be?  (Read 4601 times)

Description:

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

  • Guest
What would you want the next Amiga to be?
« on: April 11, 2007, 05:59:41 AM »
By now everybody has a good idea what I think about ideas like "saving the classic Amiga".

I think any machine that is expected to survive on the market has to evolve. That being said, there are some exceptions. The Commodore 64 was revived 2 years ago under the form of the DTV or D2TV with a bunch of games integrated in it. This added another 500'000 units to the 22 million units sold in the 1980s. But in fact, it did evolve. Even if it was no faster than the original thing, it had a color modulation system that was much better on composite TVs than the original 64 and it was based on the latest digital technology. It was much smaller than the original and it worked on batteries.

It seems to me that the latest incarnation of the Amiga, the AmigaOne, leaves a lot of people on their appetite. The attitude of the company regarding the restrictions of sale of the operating system also leaves a lot of people very frustrated.

The emergence of projects like the Minimig and the Clone-A clearly shows that modern technology can perfectly replicate the functionality of the original chip set and perhaps even the AGA chipset.

If the Amiga is to benefit the latest technology, what would you want it to be?

I think if it is possible for simple Amiga fans (perhaps the kind of fan who happens to have a masters degree in electrical engineering and digital design) to develop operational Amiga clones, it might be possible for some of thewm to join together and redefine the future of the machine.

After I get some feedback from you all, I'll give you my opinion on this.
 

Offline Methuselas

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Join Date: Feb 2002
  • Posts: 2205
    • Show only replies by Methuselas
Re: What would you want the next Amiga to be?
« Reply #1 on: April 11, 2007, 06:54:51 AM »
Anything that wasn't vapor.  :lol:
\'Using no way as way. Having no limitation as limitation.\' - Bruce Lee

\'No, sorry. I don\'t get my tits out. They\'re not actually real, you know? Just two halves of a grapefruit...\' - Miki Berenyi

\'Evil will always triumph because good is dumb.\' - Dark Helmet :roflmao:

\'And for future reference, it might be polite to ask someone if you can  quote them in your signature, rather than just citing them to make a  sales pitch.\' - Karlos. :rtf
 

  • Guest
Re: What would you want the next Amiga to be?
« Reply #2 on: April 11, 2007, 06:58:21 AM »
Quote

Methuselas wrote:
Anything that wasn't vapor.  :lol:


This answer frightens me more than just a bit... Macintoshes with OS X and intel processors aren't vaporware and neither is Windows Vista running on a Core 2 Quad.

However, I can assure you this is not what I would want the next Amiga to be.
 

Offline madsjm

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Join Date: Feb 2004
  • Posts: 223
    • Show only replies by madsjm
Re: What would you want the next Amiga to be?
« Reply #3 on: April 11, 2007, 07:21:00 AM »
I would want it to be AROS with seamless UAE integration. :lol:

Or maybe Clone-A or Minimig with AGA support, truecolour graphics, flickerfixer, scandoubler and a fast processor.

It wouldn't really need to evolve much from my current A4000 setup, as most of the software I run was made more than ten years ago. USB would be nice, however.

I would definitely not want an Amiga-in-a-joystick thing.
 

Offline Donar

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Join Date: Aug 2006
  • Posts: 168
    • Show only replies by Donar
Re: What would you want the next Amiga to be?
« Reply #4 on: April 11, 2007, 07:34:25 AM »
As i don't need a full blown Desktop Amiga i would like a little box to tinker with...

Faster Processor eg. Embedded PPC/Coldfire (running 68k Emulation if necessary.)or an 68060 in an FPGA@200MHz (seems we have to wait for the appropriate FPGA for the last one...)

Enhanced ChipSet with some of the AAA features possibly AGA compatible (eAGA???).

Running OS 3.9 or native AROS with integrated UAE.

Maybe a "big box" version with PCI/AGP connector

Oh what's that for a noise in the backround? Damn, the alarm-clock is ringing, bye bye dream land...see ya next night.
<- Amiga 1260 / CD ->
Looking for:
A1200/CF CFV4/@200,256MB,eAGA,SATA,120GB,AROS :D
 

Offline motorollin

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Join Date: Nov 2005
  • Posts: 8669
    • Show only replies by motorollin
Re: What would you want the next Amiga to be?
« Reply #5 on: April 11, 2007, 08:48:04 AM »
Don't care what the hardware is TBH. But I dream of OS4 with integrated UAE so WHDLoad games will still run.

--
moto
Code: [Select]
10  IT\'S THE FINAL COUNTDOWN
20  FOR C = 1 TO 2
30     DA-NA-NAAAA-NAAAA DA-NA-NA-NA-NAAAA
40     DA-NA-NAAAA-NAAAA DA-NA-NA-NA-NA-NA-NAAAAA
50  NEXT C
60  NA-NA-NAAAA
70  NA-NA NA-NA-NA-NA-NAAAA NAAA-NAAAAAAAAAAA
80  GOTO 10
 

Offline Waccoon

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Join Date: Apr 2002
  • Posts: 1057
    • Show only replies by Waccoon
Re: What would you want the next Amiga to be?
« Reply #6 on: April 11, 2007, 09:08:34 AM »
A new desktop built on an existing OS, and a clever new shell that doesn't have all that abbriviated UNIX naming BS.

As opposed to making an OS from scratch, trying to drag AmigaOS into the modern age (which will never work), or just making a pretty interface on top of UNIX.  The idea is to actually fix what's broken and leave the good parts alone.  UNIX is a good base, and will be mostly invisible to casual users, anyway.

And for heaven's sake, make UTF-8 and seamless networking standard.  I hate text encoding problems and FTP transfers with a passion.  UNIX is good, but it is rusty and needs a major overhaul.  The POSIX geeks are too scared to break anything.  I don't think Amigans would be too afraid to bust compatibility with some decade-old software for the sake of actually improving a few things.

Oh yeah, and put some real thought into the file requeser, too.  No OS has a decent file requester, although SkyOS is getting there (it needs a seperate app to do queries, rather than integrating it into the system browser).
 

Offline steve30

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Join Date: Nov 2005
  • Posts: 322
    • Show only replies by steve30
    • http://www.stevecoates.net
Re: What would you want the next Amiga to be?
« Reply #7 on: April 11, 2007, 09:23:00 AM »
I think a new Amiga should have a nice fast PPC processor (NOT intel), and good 68k / AGA/OCS emulation so we can run all old software without having to setup UAE like you do now.

Also, for me to be happy, it wouldn't be just a bog standard PC. It'd have to be something a little bit more proptietry. Maybe a new chipset that is better than AGA could be used?

 

Offline skurk

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Join Date: Dec 2006
  • Posts: 929
    • Show only replies by skurk
Re: What would you want the next Amiga to be?
« Reply #8 on: April 11, 2007, 09:26:52 AM »
Quote

Waccoon wrote:
UNIX is good, but it is rusty and needs a major overhaul.  The POSIX geeks are too scared to break anything.


In what way is UNIX rusty and in need of a major overhaul?
Code 6502 asm or... DIE!!

[C64, C128, A500, A600, A1200, A3000, MBP+Mini, Efika/MOS2.1, Sam440 w/AOS4.1
 

Offline coldfish

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Join Date: Nov 2003
  • Posts: 731
    • Show only replies by coldfish
Re: What would you want the next Amiga to be?
« Reply #9 on: April 11, 2007, 09:59:44 AM »
After owning a real A500 and A1200 in the past, I have my next Amiga(s);

-A Laptop running WinUAE.
-AROS bootable CD.
-UAE4all on GP2X.

For someone who was into the games more than the OS, emulation is all I'll ever need (and more).  OS4, OS5... meh, why torture yourself?

It would be nice to see an A500 in-a-stick (like the C64DTV) at some point, but if it cant run disk images easily, then I probably wouldnt bother.
 

Offline Waccoon

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Join Date: Apr 2002
  • Posts: 1057
    • Show only replies by Waccoon
Re: What would you want the next Amiga to be?
« Reply #10 on: April 11, 2007, 10:46:02 AM »
Quote
steve30:  I think a new Amiga should have a nice fast PPC processor (NOT intel)

Keep in mind that computers are not all about CPUs.  A CPU isn't that useful without a good chipset to go with it.  Where do you get those components affordably?  Insistance on PPC is what gave us the AmigaOne, a buggy, expensive board that is now defunct.

Think function, not form.

Quote
skurk:  "In what way is UNIX rusty and in need of a major overhaul?"

Well, I already gave two examples.  Traditional UNIX doesn't support international text encoding (or anything other than ASCII, really), and the "everything is a file" paradigm is false, because when it comes to networks, you still have to use clients with proprietary command sets (like FTP) to transfer files, instead of just using a shell prompt.  These two things alone are really huge disadvantages that have been fixed in "new" (but unpopular) UNIX implemenations, like Plan9 and Inferno.  The "old" UNIX community prefers compatibility and consistency over real improvement.

What about filetypes?  UNIX filesystems are pretty much braindead in this regard, and require higher-level layers, such as the desktop environment, to do all the dirty stuff.

Delete a file, and it's gone for good, at least at the low-level.  Higer-level interfaces are expected to manage journaling.  Much more sophisticated history management would be better.

Security is unimpressive, too.  Oh yeah, UN*X geeks laugh at Windows, but in reality, UNIX has many of the same security failings as Microsoft's OS.  The applications handle security, not the OS.  The system will cover its own butt with group accounts, but your files are still fully exposed to any program that runs on your account.  Who cares if the OS is safe?  It can be re-installed.  What about your files?  UNIX was designed for mainframes and multiuser groups where the whole is more important than the individual.  For single-user systems, UNIX (and Macs) get by on obscurity alone.

Bash is OK for simple stuff, but there's a reason why people write Perl scripts to do anything useful.  Simple concepts like arrays are difficult to perform directly through a shell.

There's no way to get the status of a shell command in progress, regardless of how parallel it is.  You just have to wait for it to finish.  You could use a complex, bloated, high-level framework to monitor that stuff, or you could just build a simple, standard batch monitor into the terminal.

UNIX has no concept of packages, either.  I have to say that ".app" archives on the Mac are a major improvement from the rather primitive way UNIX handles application files.

Why can't applications have their own scratch folders -- a "safe" place to put their configuration files and whatnot?  It would certainly make backing-up the system a heck of a lot easier, and still allow each user account to have its own configuration settings.  It would greatly improve security, too.  This is what the Windows System Registry tried to do, but failed miserably.  Dammit, I don't WANT my web browser cookies or cache to be accessible to any program running on my account!  Keep everything seperate, and don't use some bloated desktop manager API to manage it all!

Lots of things to improve.  Instead, some people still want an ancient AmigaOS running on PPC, because Intel is bad.  No wonder Microsoft still controls everything.  Almost every alternative platform isn't focused on fixing problems.  What exactly did BeOS fix?  Nothing, really, and that's why it failed.
 

Offline Varthall

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Join Date: Mar 2002
  • Posts: 633
    • Show only replies by Varthall
Re: What would you want the next Amiga to be?
« Reply #11 on: April 11, 2007, 11:03:42 AM »
A machine that runs OS4, much faster than my A1 933 MHz, using the latest PowerPC technology and available graphic cards.

Varthall
AmigaOne XE - AmigaOS 4.1 - Freescale 7457 1GHz - 1GB ram
MPlayer for OS4: https://sourceforge.net/projects/mplayer-amigaos/
 

Offline dammy

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Join Date: Nov 2002
  • Posts: 2828
    • Show only replies by dammy
Re: What would you want the next Amiga to be?
« Reply #12 on: April 11, 2007, 12:05:27 PM »
Multicore laptop running SMP AROS. OK, I got a laptop now running AROS, but neither is SMP currently.  With regard to some of the AROS remarks that others have posted, let me point them to UAE Integration bounty and the ongoing USB bounty. USB is nearing completion, so there is only a limit amount of time to donate to.  Dr. Schulz is working on putting USB into the ROM, which will give use of USB mouse/keyboard during bootup (with the eye towards a USB thumb drive being bootable once Rob is finished with FAT32).

SMP is a long way off for AROS, but the first step towards it will the completion of AROS_64 which should give AROS the foundation it's going to need.

Dammy
Dammy

https://www.facebook.com/pages/Arix-OS/414578091930728
Unless otherwise noted, I speak only for myself.
 

Offline Jose

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Join Date: Feb 2002
  • Posts: 2869
    • Show only replies by Jose
Re: What would you want the next Amiga to be?
« Reply #13 on: April 11, 2007, 01:04:03 PM »
A Cell powered motherboard with compatibility to AGA for retro stuff and decent graphics at the same time.
Defenitly not x86, that doesn't make sense even on marketing terms (loss of identity) and the x86 market is already covered anyway (Ubuntu/Kubuntu, OpenBe...)

A PS3 running AmigaOS would probably be enouph. :-D
\\"We made Amiga, they {bleep}ed it up\\"
 

Offline raddude9

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Join Date: Jun 2006
  • Posts: 12
    • Show only replies by raddude9
Re: What would you want the next Amiga to be?
« Reply #14 on: April 11, 2007, 01:24:44 PM »
I've often thought that a handheld Amiga would be really cool. The low-power PPC chips already exist and the various flavours of AmigaOS (official OS4.0 or AROS) can run well on relatively low spec machines. This to me seems like a much better idea than trying to shoe-horn Linux into a pocketable device.