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Operating System Specific Discussions => AROS Research Operating System => Topic started by: clusteruk on October 22, 2010, 02:27:31 PM
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I have been hearing for some time that the reason people do not want to use Aros is because of the lack of software. Well I hope to dispel that myths with these three videos.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FziV2z_uxnQ
Part one is about the Internet based applications, games, file maintenance and viewers and graphics applications.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xs37_nfa5CI
Part two is about the Audio and office applications. Also includes Quick Record which was funded by IMICA project and the new Quick CDRip application coming very soon for 10 euros.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bn59_VvbQR0
Part three is a view of the latest state of the NVidia Gallium 3d/2d drivers from Deadwood showing the video performance especially with the latest update. Massive speed increase and I would guess even my modest machine may be able to run 1080p soon.
Also in part three is a special treat, my first view of the wonderful AMC.
Enjoy
Steve
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..and here's what you'll need if you want to watch the above YouTube videos on AROS! http://archives.aros-exec.org/?function=showfile&file=video/misc/ytd008.i386-aros.lha
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..and here's what you'll need if you want to watch the above YouTube videos on AROS! http://archives.aros-exec.org/?function=showfile&file=video/misc/ytd008.i386-aros.lha
Thanks for posting that, I mention in the video but not in intro.
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I don't use AROS because it doesn't like my GeForce 9500.
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I don't use AROS because it doesn't like my GeForce 9500.
Are you using the Nouveau driver? If so, what is your card ProductID?
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I tried every option, including the Nouveau driver. I don't remember the exact error that I got, but it didn't get too far after picking the driver or the display mode.
Nvidia GeForce 9500 GT
VEN 10DE
DEV 0640
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I tried every option, including the Nouveau driver. I don't remember the exact error that I got, but it didn't get too far after picking the driver or the display mode.
Nvidia GeForce 9500 GT
VEN 10DE
DEV 0640
VESA modes were not working as well? Have you tried to boot Icaros or the nightly build downloaded from http://www.aros.org?
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None of the drivers like my 7300 either, including vesa. I had to use the onboard GMA.
I am using Icaros.
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I've enjoyed the videos. Thank you! :)
PS: I don't like google docs :P
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Do you know when AMC will be available for Icaros? :)
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Makes me wish I hadn't sold my 7600GT video card (or given my 9600GS to a friend's son).
I've got an Athlon64 3200+ (Socket754 single core) processor sitting around w/o an application.
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The thing that annoys me about AROS users:
1) Whenever you say "AmigaOS should go x86" they say "AmigaOS has gone x86 and it's called AROS"
2) Then you say "Can I run OctaMED SoundStudio on it then?" and they say "Yes but you need to run UAE"
That just does not compute for me.
An Amiga has to be able to run Amiga software or else it is not an Amiga.
Am I missing something here??
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The thing that annoys me about AROS users:
1) Whenever you say "AmigaOS should go x86" they say "AmigaOS has gone x86 and it's called AROS"
2) Then you say "Can I run OctaMED SoundStudio on it then?" and they say "Yes but you need to run UAE"
That just does not compute for me.
An Amiga has to be able to run Amiga software or else it is not an Amiga.
Am I missing something here??
Well, what are you missing is that AROS is on the x86 source code compatible but not binary compatible as instead will be on amiga68k - mean you will be able to run octamed on AROS on the Amiga; for a different architecture like x86 a compatibility layer such as J-UAE or (still in development) Emumiga is required;The latter one is pretty interesting since will be like a JIT interpreter for the Amiga OS system calls to AROS for all those programs that does not bang the hardware directly.
IIRC Octamed uses system gadgets and so should run under emumiga on x86 once the project will be perfectioned enough; otherwise we can hope for a x86 port :)
P.S. i was a protracker user and did my jump on milky, never was able to like octamed interface and commands :P
Saimon69
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The thing that annoys me about AROS users:
1) Whenever you say "AmigaOS should go x86" they say "AmigaOS has gone x86 and it's called AROS"
2) Then you say "Can I run OctaMED SoundStudio on it then?" and they say "Yes but you need to run UAE"
That just does not compute for me.
An Amiga has to be able to run Amiga software or else it is not an Amiga.
Am I missing something here??
Yes, you're missing the point that the benchmark you've set (for being considered an Amiga) is impossible on anything other than an original Amiga.
Without a 68k processor and compatibility with the original chipsets, every otherOS relies on emulation of some kind.
That's one of the reasons I don't worry about MorphOS not being considered a true Amiga system. It isn't and it wasn't meant to be. It was designed to work with newer hardware and improve on AOS. That couldn't be done w/o sacrificing register level compatibility.
AROS actually may (in the long run) prove to be more compatible with AOS3.x than AOS4.x or MOS (due to its better integration of UAE).
However, with OS compatibility with 3.1, MorphOS and AROS share a common positive you're not considering. Porting software from AOS to these NG systems is relatively easy because the OS' supports the same functions (in fact in the case of MOS even 68K code will work as long as it isn't hardware dependant).
So while many (like you) point to the fact that an NG OS will not run a specific app you're using (w/o emulation) you're overlooking that these software packages (if they were still being developed and supported ) could be easily moved to an NG OS.
I'm not familar with Octamed, but I have seen Audio Evolution (another Amiga music program). Currently, AE is available on AOS, MOS, AROS, Windows and OSX and the non-Amiga versions are more advanced and continue to be developed.
I can't think of too many old software packages (that are no longer supported or continue to be developed) that I have to rely on. So, I'm satisfied with my OS choice (as, I'm sure, are many AROS users).
The only new hardware that would meet your requirements is something like the Natami. That system sounds interesting, but I can't see using one as my primary computer (any more than I could imagine using an original Amiga as my sole computer).
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Yes, you're missing the point that the benchmark you've set (for being considered an Amiga) is impossible on anything other than an original Amiga.
Without a 68k processor and compatibility with the original chipsets, every otherOS relies on emulation of some kind.
That's one of the reasons I don't worry about MorphOS not being considered a true Amiga system. It isn't and it wasn't meant to be. It was designed to work with newer hardware and improve on AOS. That couldn't be done w/o sacrificing resister level compatibility.
AROS actually may (in the long run) prove to be more compatible with AOS3.x than AOS4.x or MOS (due to its better integration of UAE).
However, with OS compatibility with 3.1, MorphOS and AROS share a common positive you're not considering. Porting software from AOS to these NG systems is relatively easy because the OS' supports the same functions (in fact in the case of MOS even 68K code will work as long as it isn't hardware dependant).
So while many (like you) point to the fact that an NG OS will not run a specific app you're using (w/o emulation) you're overlooking that these software packages (if they were still being developed and supported ) could be easily moved to an NG OS.
I'm not familar with Octamed, but I have seen Audio Evolution (another Amiga music program). Currently, AE is available on AOS, MOS, AROS, Windows and OSX and the non-Amiga versions are more advanced and continue to be developed.
I can't think of too many old software packages (that are no longer supported or continue to be developed) that I have to rely on. So, I'm satisfied with my OS choice (as, I'm sure, are many AROS users).
The only new hardware that would meet your requirements is something like the Natami. That system sounds interesting, but I can't see using one as my primary computer (any more than I could imagine using an original Amiga as my sole computer).
Yes my ideal Amiga would be a 1 GHz 3.9 setup to be honest. I just think that if i'm going to be breaking compatibility with my Amiga by using AROS, then I might as well just use Windows instead.
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Yes my ideal Amiga would be a 1 GHz 3.9 setup to be honest. I just think that if i'm going to be breaking compatibility with my Amiga by using AROS, then I might as well just use Windows instead.
Unless Thomas and Gunnar secure a LOT more money, you're not going to see a 1 Ghz 68K (although that WOULD be pretty cool).
As much as I hate to admit it, Windows is a valid option (remember that unoffical motto - Windows X, it suck much less now!). Personally, I'd choose it over OSX. Plus, if you're going to rely on emulation, Amiga Forever is a surprisingly good package.
So why am I using a MorphOS system (when I have two copies of WinXP Media Center and one copy of Vista)?
First, really fast boot times.
Second, efficiency. MOS performs much better than OSX on PPC machines.
Third, it provides an advanced Amiga like development platform.
Fourth, its different (and I'm not supporting Gates or Jobs).
Fifth, it is a practical platform for every day use that carries forward an OS I'm very fond of.
So, the question I always like to propose to people in your position is this - have you tried an NG OS?
AROS is free and if you're going to move to Windows, well you're already getting an X86 systems - why not try it?
MorphOS can be downloaded. The Amiga/PPC accelerated version is free and the later versions can be used as a trial version (that works for 30 minutes before slowing down). I put together my original Quicksilver based system for under $75 (so when MOS 2.6 was introduced I didn't have much invested).
I was skeptical at first, but since I adopted it, I haven't used Windows (at all, for about the last two months).
To everyone, before you decide, you ought to give an NG OS a try.
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@Iggy
I'm not familar with Octamed, but I have seen Audio Evolution (another Amiga music program). Currently, AE is available on AOS, MOS, AROS, Windows and OSX and the non-Amiga versions are more advanced and continue to be developed.
You're talking chalk and cheese I'm afraid. AE is very good, but it's a multitrack recording system with MIDI support. OMSS, on the other hand, is a multichannel tracker with MIDI support. The former is primarily for production, the latter is primarily for composition. OMSS may be years old and look "primitive" to people that have never used it, but trust me, a person couldn't be more wrong for thinking it. It's one of the finest pieces of software ever written for quickly getting your ideas down.
You can't just magically go from OMSS to AE, they work in completely different ways and are built for totally different purposes. If you use OMSS to compose, the chances are you would also use AE for post-production work / live instrument / vocal mixdown.
Like Tension, I also use OMSS and don't have any serious time for an Amiga compatible OS that doesn't run it. An OS is there to support your applications as much as it is to support your hardware.
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Well if it's OctaMED you want, just use the PC version. I have it here (though not used it for years :( there are simply better trackers out there now, not that I use trackers anymore)... But it does work in Wine so it will run on your OSX/*nix boxes too.
@Tension, that is a somewhat limited view of an Operating System... The SuSE linux install on my Athlon64 can't run the same software that the uC Linux I have installed on my ARM Dev board runs (without a recompile), but they are the same operating system no?
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Well if it's OctaMED you want, just use the PC version. I have it here (though not used it for years :( there are simply better trackers out there now, not that I use trackers anymore)... But it does work in Wine so it will run on your OSX/*nix boxes too.
Better is a subjective term. OctaMED SS is more than capable of controlling my kit and after so many years of using it, I just know where everything is.
I tried the PC version and frankly was not very impressed. There seemed to be an awful lot of lag from keypress to note playback when editing with it. Unfortunately, I tend to notice the same issue when running it in both WinUAE and E-UAE and adjusting the sound buffers for lower latency tends to produce some stuttering effects.
Conversely, OS3.x/4.x run it just fine on both my A1200 and A1 without these issues.
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Better is a subjective term. OctaMED SS is more than capable of controlling my kit and after so many years of using it, I just know where everything is.
I have so little outbord hardware now (mostly just midi/USB controllers) I don't need controllers... You have to love Arturia's softsynths :)
I tried the PC version and frankly was not very impressed. There seemed to be an awful lot of lag from keypress to note playback when editing with it. Unfortunately, I tend to notice the same issue when running it in both WinUAE and E-UAE and adjusting the sound buffers for lower latency tends to produce some stuttering effects.
ok, I can see your problem. I don't have any latency issues with UAE (what there is isn't noticeable and if I want any output I'll mix down to disk anyway).
Conversely, OS3.x/4.x run it just fine on both my A1200 and A1 without these issues.
Fair enough, but Tension might want to invest a little time learning a few more modern Trackers... It's both fun, and rewarding :)
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Yes my ideal Amiga would be a 1 GHz 3.9 setup to be honest. I just think that if i'm going to be breaking compatibility with my Amiga by using AROS, then I might as well just use Windows instead.
1. AROS for Amiga68K is in the works. Goal is to run AOS apps on those AROS based Amiga 68K machines.
2. OS4 and MOS both use a 68K emulator. You like running AOS 68K apps on those OSs, you shouldn't have any issues running AOS apps on a full blown emulator like JanusUAE. Emulation is emulation.
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I have so little outbord hardware now (mostly just midi/USB controllers) I don't need controllers... You have to love Arturia's softsynths :)
I don't mind using them, but composition still happens in OMSS :)
ok, I can see your problem. I don't have any latency issues with UAE (what there is isn't noticeable and if I want any output I'll mix down to disk anyway).
It only affects editing, which is the strange thing. Normal playback is fine. You could put it down to a "slow" PC, but I suspect it's not that (see signature).
Fair enough, but Tension might want to invest a little time learning a few more modern Trackers... It's both fun, and rewarding :)
Sure, I was talking from my own perspective.
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Fair enough, but Tension might want to invest a little time learning a few more modern Trackers... It's both fun, and rewarding :)
Yeah but i'm trying to put it off as long as possible because OSS is the only "killer app" I have on the Amiga. All my mates have been trying to convert me to Ableton/Reason/Logic for years now, and I must admit it does look very tempting.
I fear that once I stop using OSS, that will be the end of my Amiga journey forever. :(
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Yeah but i'm trying to put it off as long as possible because OSS is the only "killer app" I have on the Amiga. All my mates have been trying to convert me to Ableton/Reason/Logic for years now, and I must admit it does look very tempting.
I fear that once I stop using OSS, that will be the end of my Amiga journey forever. :(
That's an interesting insight in your logic. Perhaps the reason I had no problem moving on into NG is that there were no compelling software packages I had to keep.
This kind of explains some of the fragmentation in our community. Some of us are devoted to the original hardware or software. Others are focused on the OS and its later derivitives. Looking at this from your viewpoint (the former position), its easier to understand your arguement over what is (or is not) an Amiga.
We're not even on the same page when we discuss this question.
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Yeah but i'm trying to put it off as long as possible because OSS is the only "killer app" I have on the Amiga. All my mates have been trying to convert me to Ableton/Reason/Logic for years now, and I must admit it does look very tempting.
Logic and Reason are damn near perfect production and composition tools, though they overlap quite a bit in functionality... I find Reason good for getting stuff going and Logic for cleaning it all up and putting that Pro edge on it.
Ableton is singular for live work. I never used Logic's Mainstage (live performance) software live but it did seem quite good... but at the end of the day on Stage you want something reliable and most importantly RELIABLE (I know technically that is only one thing... but it's so important). Ableton has been 100% reliable for me for live work and that has covered something near 500 gigs!
I fear that once I stop using OSS, that will be the end of my Amiga journey forever. :(
Nah, even up to 2008 I was still sampling and tracking on my A1200. I like grungy audio and the Octamed interface... So I use it... :)
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Am I missing something here??
The definition of 'amiga system' is a personal opinion, not a law.
Staf.
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The definition of 'amiga system' is a personal opinion, not a law.
Staf.
How is that possible? In the same way that being black is a state of mind?
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The definition of 'amiga system' is a personal opinion, not a law.
Staf.
Correction, 'Amiga' is a trademark (covered by US laws). Our personal opinions as to what is or is not an 'Amiga System' are just that, opinions.
Thanks to CUSA and AInc. that definition is going to get seriously muddied.
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Well if it's OctaMED you want, just use the PC version. I have it here (though not used it for years :( there are simply better trackers out there now, not that I use trackers anymore)... But it does work in Wine so it will run on your OSX/*nix boxes too.
LMAROF!
You're not serious. Really. OSS for the PC is a skippy buggy abomination that gives the concept of a "tracker" software a really bad name.
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A question that I'd love to know the answer to is: Why does OctaMED Sound Studio work perfectly on OS4.1 running on a Pegasos II but not on MorphOS running on the exact same machine?
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For me AROS has software and good, but not one USB reader systems, why? very easy to explain, I programming things in Amiga OS4 but with Hollywood and I tryed to port my programs tested in AROS from a VMWare but never I got that from USB drive or a CDRW tested my projects, currently is possible AROS from VMWare read the contend inside of a pendrive USB?
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A question that I'd love to know the answer to is: Why does OctaMED Sound Studio work perfectly on OS4.1 running on a Pegasos II but not on MorphOS running on the exact same machine?
Well, I would guess that AOS4.1 has better legacy compatibility. MorphOS
really only supports software that doen't access hardware directly.
The posters worried about AmigaOS' with the capability to run this package should find your post enlightening.
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Before we assume the sky has fallen on it, has anybody actually tested OctaMED SS on MorphOS with "The Maestrix" utility installed?
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For me AROS has software and good, but not one USB reader systems, why? very easy to explain, I programming things in Amiga OS4 but with Hollywood and I tryed to port my programs tested in AROS from a VMWare but never I got that from USB drive or a CDRW tested my projects, currently is possible AROS from VMWare read the contend inside of a pendrive USB?
@templario
that is not AROS fault, especially since Poseidon, more from the settings of the Virtual Machine created; i generated through easywmx (http://easyvmx.com/) a wmdk file disk with USB enabled (can be changed editing the .vmx file) and once started the machine was able to access the stick from vmware (being unmounted from win in the meanwhile though).
Saimon69
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Before we assume the sky has fallen on it, has anybody actually tested OctaMED SS on MorphOS with "The Maestrix" utility installed?
I wasn't even aware of that utility till you mention it Karlos. Looks interesting.
Hopefully Nichols sees your post as I don't have Octamed to check.
It might work. Frequently AOS packages can run (under MorphOS) with tweaks like this.
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I wasn't even aware of that utility till you mention it Karlos. Looks interesting.
Hopefully Nichols sees your post as I don't have Octamed to check.
It might work. Frequently AOS packages can run (under MorphOS) with tweaks like this.
Alas I've not got a Peg2 in the house to test it with now but hopefully someone who does can.
I can give it a try on the eMac and the Quicksilver though, I guess if it works on those two it should work on any MorphOS machine.
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How is that possible? In the same way that being black is a state of mind?
I may have made this invalid conclusion when I saw that your definition is totally different from what Carl Sassenrath calls an 'amiga system' or, like Iggy says, is the only true trademark conforming definition of an 'Amiga system'.
greets,
Staf.
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@templario
that is not AROS fault, especially since Poseidon, more from the settings of the Virtual Machine created; i generated through easywmx (http://easyvmx.com/) a wmdk file disk with USB enabled (can be changed editing the .vmx file) and once started the machine was able to access the stick from vmware (being unmounted from win in the meanwhile though).
Saimon69
Well, someday when I have free time I'll try to test AROS and my programs in it.
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I may have made this invalid conclusion when I saw that your definition is totally different from what Carl Sassenrath calls an 'amiga system' or, like Iggy says, is the only true trademark conforming definition of an 'Amiga system'.
greets,
Staf.
What do you mean? An Amiga system has to run AmigaOS, which in turn must be able to run Amiga programs.
what does Sassenrath say on the matter?