Analogy: Amiga and UNIX

[jtsiren]

I just read a short history on UNIX here:

http://www.albion.com/security/intro-2.html

In the end of that history, the author concludes that since there are many UNIX-like operating systems (clones, if you will) out there, he will call all of them UNIX...

"I define UNIX as

A set of enabling technologies first developed at AT&T that have been incorporated into several legally distinct but closely related operating systems, each of which can be considered to be a "UNIX system." If it looks like UNIX, operates like UNIX, runs common UNIX utilities and programs, and is developed with UNIX as a model, it's UNIX."

Now, replace the word UNIX with Amiga or amiga (or perhaps AmigaOS), and AT&T with Amiga/Commodore, and you will very likely have a good analogy of UNIX and the current situation in the Amiga market. AROS and MorphOS have become our Linux and NetBSD in comparison to the original, trademarked operating system (AmigaOS and UNIX).

Perhaps we could use the years of UNIX experience (and debates in the UNIX community) as something to draw from to find a concensus within the Amiga community as to what to consider as Amiga or amiga. I often see the argument "MorphOS has nothing to do with Amiga", and I believe that to be like saying "Linux has nothing to do with UNIX"...

Is Linux UNIX? No. The definition quoted above is an over-simplification that may have some purpose in casual talk, but is technically misleading. But Linux is *nix. Just as MorphOS and AROS are *miga, if you will. That is my opinion, and I believe the concesus that seems to represent the majority in the UNIX community would very much seem to support this.

Any thoughts on this? Can you think of any other operating systems that have a history of being cloned? Also, is there something else we can learn from UNIX? How have these different UNIXes evolved? Is there co-operation between their makers? What about things like POSIX? Perhaps these could also help us support a future where different Amiga-like solutions can be somewhat compatible and support eachother and the marketplace while competing also.

Please discuss.

(I do note that we have the question of classic Amiga hardware to consider, but I would like to leave that outside of this argument since that technology is becoming pretty much obsolete anyway. I am trying to form an analogy between AmigaOS and UNIX, not Amiga hardware.)

[DaveP]

This one seems to pop up quite frequently. A system
is a UNIX if it has been CERTIFIED to be UNIX.

Otherwise it is Unix-like.

[Coder]

Hi,

Does anyone remember the names of the people in charge of getting Unix on the Amiga? I cannot remember the names. Shame on me. I know that one of them had glasses. Well, that leaves a few million left. :-D

Coder

[DaveP]

Do you mean the APUS team?

There are also the groups that work on getting
distros to work with the A1 - which you know
the names of seeings you were on the uber-secret
A1G3Dev list.

[jtsiren]

>Otherwise it is Unix-like.

Certainly, from a legal and pedantic point of view.

But for the casual folk, or be that casual computer hobbyists, "Unix" means a whole bunch of operating systems (although Linux is gaining ground so rapidly people may start talking of Linux-like operating systems soon :-)... Just like it would feel natural to call AROS and MorphOS "Amiga" in casual talk.

I mean a bit like this:

"Hmm. This problem would be easily solved with UNIX. X has just the right tools for this."

"Okay, shall we choose Solaris, NetBSD or Linux for the job?"

"Let's go with Linux this time, it is free."

And...

"Hmm. This problem would be easily solved with Amiga. Intuition has just the right tools for this."

"Okay, shall we choose AmigaOS, AROS or MorphOS for the job?"

"Let's go with AROS this time, it is free."

[Coder]

@DaveP

I am on the list but I do not see names that ring a bell. I will check it out. They were also in the Deathbed Vigil video. I might have a look at that again. :-)

Coder

[jtsiren]

>I am on the list but I do not see names that ring a
>bell. I will check it out. They were also in the
>Deathbed Vigil video. I might have a look at that
>again.

You mean the people that worked on the A3000UX's UNIX? System V was that?

[alx]

Remember that AmigaOS was originally derived from Tripos, a UNIX varient - not many people realise how AmigaOS and UNIX are related!

[Coder]

@jtsiren

You mean the people that worked on the A3000UX's UNIX?

Correct.

Coder

[DaveP]

@alx

Thank you! I was trying to remember a couple
of days back what the AmigaOS origins was during
a flamewar and I had to keep out of it because
I just couldn't remember!

Tripos! :-D

@coder
Think we are crossing wires bud :-)

[downix]

alx wrote:
Remember that AmigaOS was originally derived from Tripos, a UNIX varient - not many people realise how AmigaOS and UNIX are related!

I always found TripOS closer to VMS than UNIX... but then again, I see the comparison.

I loved browsing the TripOS source code, it was a breeze even if in BCPL.

[DaveP]

@Downix

Closer to VMS??

***shudder***

I speak after having spent three years programming
on VAX/VMS and then OpenVMS running on a Dec
Alpha both of which required huge command strings to change "directory"(disk really).

Powcon conferencing system was good though.

What a god-awful system that was.  :-o

[Coder]

About the Amiga Unix people. I mean Keith Gabryelaki. I also thought Bryce Nesbitt but he did work on the Amiga OS.

Coder  

[dammy]

by downix on 2003/2/15 10:05:01

I always found TripOS closer to VMS than UNIX... but then again, I see the comparison.

I loved browsing the TripOS source code, it was a breeze even if in BCPL.

Say, isn't NT based on VMS?

Dammy

[downix]

@DaveP

If you'd like to see TripOS, go to http://www.cl.cam.ac.uk/users/mr/Tripos.html for Cintpos, a modern version of TripOS by TripOS's original author.